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2016-11-23 07:06:35 GMT <sumit> Hi, in pdf-toolkit it looks there is no input field for value if watermark type is text. that's operation gets failed.any idea plz??
2016-11-23 08:05:19 GMT <yreg> Morning guys !
2016-11-23 08:05:38 GMT <yreg> fcorti, can you point me towards the source code for Alfresco Share services AMP ?
2016-11-23 08:06:37 GMT <yreg> found it : https://github.com/Alfresco/share/tree/master/share-services
2016-11-23 08:06:38 GMT <alfbot> Title: share/share-services at master · Alfresco/share · GitHub (at github.com)
2016-11-23 08:15:53 GMT <fcorti> morning yreg
2016-11-23 08:16:26 GMT <yreg> Hey Francesco !
2016-11-23 08:16:29 GMT <yreg> How it goes ?
2016-11-23 08:16:41 GMT <fcorti> nice...
2016-11-23 08:17:01 GMT <fcorti> lot's of things to do but I start to understand how it works :-)
2016-11-23 08:17:09 GMT <fcorti> what about your new life?
2016-11-23 08:17:25 GMT <ycoulon> Morning all
2016-11-23 08:17:37 GMT <fcorti> morning ycoulon
2016-11-23 08:17:55 GMT <fcorti> yreg: I'm asking to right ones ;-)
2016-11-23 08:20:42 GMT <yreg> I can say the same over here !
2016-11-23 08:23:30 GMT <yreg> I am thinking about joining some evening class to learn some Dutch just to get better integration with locals
2016-11-23 08:35:37 GMT <fcorti> perfectly understand... understanding the local language is relevant
2016-11-23 08:35:54 GMT <fcorti> I experienced the same with my wife (she is not italian)
2016-11-23 08:52:28 GMT <fcorti> yreg: the issue of the github is the same affected the replication of the public sources
2016-11-23 08:52:35 GMT <fcorti> until it will be solved
2016-11-23 08:52:46 GMT <fcorti> you can find the source code here
2016-11-23 08:52:47 GMT <fcorti> https://svn.alfresco.com/repos/alfresco-open-mirror/web-apps/Share/trunk/share-services/
2016-11-23 08:52:49 GMT <alfbot> Title: alfresco-open-mirror - Revision 133032: /web-apps/Share/trunk/share-services (at svn.alfresco.com)
2016-11-23 08:53:04 GMT <fcorti> Please let me know if you need something else
2016-11-23 08:53:19 GMT <yreg> thanks
2016-11-23 08:53:38 GMT <fcorti> you are welome
2016-11-23 08:53:43 GMT <fcorti> welcome
2016-11-23 09:29:45 GMT <praisethemoon> hedi, o/
2016-11-23 09:30:03 GMT <hedi> hello everybody
2016-11-23 09:33:59 GMT <hedi> how can i add mandatory aspects to a type shipped under alfresco?
2016-11-23 09:36:43 GMT <angelborroy> hedi you can’t
2016-11-23 09:36:51 GMT <angelborroy> hedi without modifying original content model
2016-11-23 09:37:04 GMT <angelborroy> hedi which IMO is not an option
2016-11-23 09:37:30 GMT <angelborroy> hedi you can create a new type inheriting from cm:content and include in this new type your mandatory aspects
2016-11-23 09:38:12 GMT <yreg> hedi, How it goes pal ?
2016-11-23 09:38:30 GMT <yreg> I can see you finally found your way to this channel :D
2016-11-23 09:59:21 GMT <Vasquez> good morning guys and girls :)
2016-11-23 10:00:07 GMT <Vasquez> have anyone ever done some synchronious ajax call
2016-11-23 10:00:41 GMT <Vasquez> what i need is while successCallback is called i need to show some message, or spinner
2016-11-23 10:00:44 GMT <Vasquez> any idea?
2016-11-23 10:06:16 GMT <angelborroy> Vasquez if using YUI, this can help you https://angelborroy.wordpress.com/2016/08/10/alfresco-share-actions-adding-a-waiting-dialog-while-performing-action-in-repo/
2016-11-23 10:06:17 GMT <alfbot> Title: Alfresco Share actions: adding a waiting dialog while performing action in repo | Programming and So (at angelborroy.wordpress.com)
2016-11-23 10:08:24 GMT <Vasquez> @angelborroy thank you very much i will give it a try
2016-11-23 10:11:47 GMT <yreg> Vasquez, Have you ever considered using promises ?
2016-11-23 10:13:37 GMT <angelborroy> yreg promises + YUI???
2016-11-23 10:14:32 GMT <hedi> angelborroy, idk if that's an option, i'm actually trying to upgrade an alfresco instance with so many features developed by directly changing alfresco's code so the modified types are used in so many places
2016-11-23 10:14:47 GMT <hedi> yreg, fine thanks i hope you're good
2016-11-23 10:15:06 GMT <yreg> I understand it is a bad mix, but I managed to make work once
2016-11-23 10:15:45 GMT <Vasquez> i havent seen anything about promises in documentation that i read
2016-11-23 10:16:09 GMT <yreg> angelborroy, you just need to tweak the js compress thing in order to accept promises
2016-11-23 10:16:38 GMT <Vasquez> to be honest i hate js, i am java developer, but every once in a while i get frontend tasks
2016-11-23 10:17:04 GMT <yreg> I've done it in some ancient ant project a while back by switching to the newest YUI compressor jars
2016-11-23 10:17:59 GMT <yreg> I am sure it can be done in the maven yui compressor plugin at the cost of some bug that only appears on windows in a totally different context
2016-11-23 10:19:19 GMT <angelborroy> yreg does it worth? there is no risk to any other Alfresco features?
2016-11-23 10:21:26 GMT <yreg> None that I am aware of !
2016-11-23 10:42:33 GMT <fwu> hi all
2016-11-23 10:43:24 GMT <fwu> ppl, can someone explian me what is the Alfresco offer stated here: https://www.alfresco.com/capabilities/mobile-content-management
2016-11-23 10:43:26 GMT <alfbot> Title: Mobile Content Management | Alfresco (at www.alfresco.com)
2016-11-23 10:47:23 GMT <fwu> is this offer using the standard Alfresco mobile apps?
2016-11-23 10:50:46 GMT <fcorti> yes, if I understand your question
2016-11-23 11:05:46 GMT <yreg> does any one know why I am not supposed to do solr queries during bootstrap?
2016-11-23 11:05:49 GMT <yreg> https://github.com/Alfresco/community-edition/blob/2c1eff9953d3105e738f7b06ba9ba8a079ca4c24/projects/repository/source/java/org/alfresco/repo/search/impl/solr/SolrQueryHTTPClient.java#L384
2016-11-23 11:05:50 GMT <alfbot> Title: community-edition/SolrQueryHTTPClient.java at 2c1eff9953d3105e738f7b06ba9ba8a079ca4c24 · Alfresco/community-edition · GitHub (at github.com)
2016-11-23 11:07:28 GMT <douglascrp> yreg, I believe that there is no way to make sure the subsystem is available
2016-11-23 11:07:36 GMT <douglascrp> btw... good morning everyone
2016-11-23 11:35:59 GMT <fwu> how can I get the profile of one user using the Alfresco connection of other user? lol
2016-11-23 11:36:22 GMT <AFaust> yreg: You are not supposed to do any SOLR queries during bootstrap because any changes that have been made during that bootstrap are guaranteed to NOT be reflected in the SOLR index.
2016-11-23 11:37:35 GMT <AFaust> douglascrp: The subsystem will actually be started when you call it (even if it has not been started as part of the normal starup sequence yet).
2016-11-23 11:38:17 GMT <douglascrp> AFaust, tks for the info
2016-11-23 11:38:28 GMT <AFaust> yreg: If you start leaning Dutch, you will automatically get one third of the way towards learning German...
2016-11-23 11:43:26 GMT <yreg> AFaust, I already took 400 hours of German back in 2005->2009
2016-11-23 11:43:44 GMT <yreg> So I guess that should make Dutch a lot easier ?
2016-11-23 11:45:05 GMT <yreg> Well I already forgot 90% of what I learnt :-P but still, that should count as a backgroud
2016-11-23 11:45:25 GMT <yreg> *should count
2016-11-23 11:45:55 GMT <AFaust> Hmm - so you are familiar with French, English and have some very old, spotty knowledge of German. Theoretically you should almost be fluent in Dutch already.
2016-11-23 11:46:27 GMT <AFaust> After all, is is a strange mix of those three languages (well, smaller part French, larger part German)
2016-11-23 11:47:01 GMT <AFaust> Pronounciation might be the biggest issue
2016-11-23 11:48:18 GMT <yreg> LoL, agreed !
2016-11-23 11:49:06 GMT <douglascrp> yreg, duolingo man
2016-11-23 11:51:06 GMT <fwu> this must be a bug in this release
2016-11-23 11:56:06 GMT <yreg> thanks for the suggestion douglascrp
2016-11-23 11:56:17 GMT <yreg> will give it a try this evening
2016-11-23 11:56:51 GMT <douglascrp> yreg, it helped me a lot with my "Spanish", if I can call it spanish :D
2016-11-23 11:57:44 GMT <angelborroy> douglascrp tu español es más que bueno, nada comparable a mi “English” :D
2016-11-23 11:57:50 GMT <fwu> ppl, is the community edition compatible with oracle, sql server and db2?
2016-11-23 11:57:59 GMT <angelborroy> fwu no
2016-11-23 11:58:32 GMT <douglascrp> angelborroy, muchas gracias
2016-11-23 11:58:54 GMT <douglascrp> I started learning german too
2016-11-23 11:58:59 GMT <douglascrp> Ich bin ein Mann
2016-11-23 11:59:03 GMT <douglascrp> that's all I know :D
2016-11-23 12:00:04 GMT <angelborroy> douglascrp my wife speaks German everyday and my son is studying at a German School…
2016-11-23 12:00:17 GMT <douglascrp> nice
2016-11-23 12:00:25 GMT <angelborroy> douglascrp … and I’m not able even to understand your simple sentence :)
2016-11-23 12:00:35 GMT <douglascrp> wow
2016-11-23 12:00:50 GMT <yreg> douglascrp, do you know what is the most useful German reply ?
2016-11-23 12:01:01 GMT <douglascrp> yreg, I have no idea
2016-11-23 12:01:06 GMT <yreg> angelborroy, luckily you have google translate for that :D
2016-11-23 12:01:37 GMT <yreg> Ich verstehe nicht. Sprechen Sie English ?
2016-11-23 12:01:48 GMT <yreg> Englisch*
2016-11-23 12:02:04 GMT <douglascrp> google translate comes to rescue
2016-11-23 12:02:46 GMT <yreg> douglascrp, angelborroy especially with that android app with speech recognition... it is just amazing !
2016-11-23 12:03:09 GMT <angelborroy> yreg I’m iOS / Mac user (by now)
2016-11-23 12:03:10 GMT <douglascrp> yreg, perfect :D
2016-11-23 12:03:45 GMT <douglascrp> yreg, in my case, it would be Ich verstehe nicht. Sprechen Sie Portuguese ?
2016-11-23 12:05:14 GMT <yreg> angelborroy, that feature does exist in the IOS app as well : https://itunes.apple.com/be/app/google-translate/id414706506?mt=8$*
2016-11-23 12:05:15 GMT <alfbot> Title: Google Translate on the App Store (at itunes.apple.com)
2016-11-23 12:06:17 GMT <angelborroy> yreg I had bad experiences with Google Translator in the past, so I’m not using it since some years ago
2016-11-23 12:07:58 GMT <angelborroy> yreg when I analyse “automatic” translations from English to Spanish… wow
2016-11-23 12:08:47 GMT <yreg> is it that bad ?
2016-11-23 12:09:01 GMT <angelborroy> nearly Greek
2016-11-23 12:10:03 GMT <fwu> angelborroy, none of the three?
2016-11-23 12:10:39 GMT <angelborroy> I mean: final Spanish tranlation looks like Greek
2016-11-23 12:13:00 GMT <IanW1> I see SSO is broken again in 5.2 - anybody looked at it?
2016-11-23 12:13:13 GMT <angelborroy> buf… seriously?
2016-11-23 12:13:35 GMT <angelborroy> IanW1 I have 2 or 3 patches for 5.1
2016-11-23 12:13:53 GMT <angelborroy> IanW1 and even that, it hardly works
2016-11-23 12:15:00 GMT <IanW1> I have it working for 5.1.g with CAS - it's a bit of a hack for deep linking and I'm really not sure about the repo side...
2016-11-23 12:30:39 GMT <douglascrp> IanW1, again?
2016-11-23 12:31:37 GMT <IanW1> Yup - again... - it was working briefly in 5.1.g
2016-11-23 12:31:53 GMT <IanW1> For a change somebody else spotted it this time!
2016-11-23 12:33:40 GMT <AFaust> one of these days I actually should set up a server with CAS to see what all the fuss is about...
2016-11-23 12:33:53 GMT <AFaust> in terms of bugs I mean..
2016-11-23 12:36:41 GMT <IanW1> Actually it's not really anything to do with CAS - effectively CAS is just populating the getRemoteUser() value so it's simpler than that...
2016-11-23 12:44:29 GMT <AFaust> Sure - but as far as I know, the SSO problems mostly affect the external subsystem, right? I mean just yesterday I migrated a customer to 5.1 and they use Kerberos SSO without any hiccups
2016-11-23 12:46:13 GMT <IanW1> I think it depends on what form of SSO you are using
2016-11-23 12:46:26 GMT <IanW1> 5.1.g seems to be OK
2016-11-23 12:47:39 GMT <IanW1> Anything that depends on getRemoteUser is broken from 5.0.d to 5.1.f inclusive and 5.2....
2016-11-23 12:48:56 GMT <IanW1> There was a problem in the SlingshotAlfrescoConnector - my patch was rejected - don't know why - I have asked
2016-11-23 12:49:49 GMT <IanW1> I suspect it's the SSOAuthenticationFilter now but haven't really looked yet
2016-11-23 12:51:32 GMT <IanW1> I probably started this all off when I asked for the new CMIS endpoint to be made available via the share proxy...
2016-11-23 12:53:45 GMT <AFaust> IanW1: You just reported the issues and didn't provide it as a contribution, right?
2016-11-23 12:54:02 GMT <IanW1> right
2016-11-23 12:54:53 GMT <IanW1> I wouldn't dare get into changing any of this
2016-11-23 12:55:03 GMT <AFaust> Yeah - that would probably be a topic where I wouldn't file an issue before I had it all figured out myself and could provide a patch file.
2016-11-23 12:55:20 GMT <AFaust> Maybe I have trust issues with regards to "fixing complex issues"
2016-11-23 12:56:12 GMT <IanW1> The patch I suggested was just reverting behaviour to something that looked more sensible than what it was changed to (and worked...)
2016-11-23 13:05:34 GMT <irena> Hi all, I have a question - we have a problem with alfresco on two application servers. When user changes a password the change is not reflected on the second one
2016-11-23 13:08:18 GMT <angelborroy> irena how is your cluster configured?
2016-11-23 13:11:24 GMT <irena> 2 application servers, 2 Solr (Master-Slave), 1 database and 1 content store
2016-11-23 13:12:46 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: Have you worked or thought about implementing a chainable NodeRef?
2016-11-23 13:13:03 GMT <AFaust> "chainable" NodeRef?
2016-11-23 13:13:33 GMT <bhagyas> yeah, a nodeRef that returns itself (acts more like a ScriptNode
2016-11-23 13:13:34 GMT <bhagyas> )
2016-11-23 13:13:41 GMT <bhagyas> after each operation
2016-11-23 13:13:57 GMT <AFaust> Ah - you mean fluent API style
2016-11-23 13:14:03 GMT <irena> i don't what that is :)
2016-11-23 13:14:14 GMT <bhagyas> yes
2016-11-23 13:14:24 GMT <yreg> bhagyas, AFaust functional programming style ?
2016-11-23 13:14:46 GMT <bhagyas> possibly
2016-11-23 13:14:48 GMT <bhagyas> but yeah
2016-11-23 13:14:52 GMT <yreg> like that lambda expression thing that was introduced in java 8 ?
2016-11-23 13:14:54 GMT <irena> is the chainable noderef going to help me with the replication between the 2 application servers?
2016-11-23 13:15:00 GMT <AFaust> irena: is your cluster (application servers) properly working with the Hazelcast layer?
2016-11-23 13:15:08 GMT <AFaust> irena: Sorry - different conversation
2016-11-23 13:15:39 GMT <bhagyas> ChainableNodeRef siteNodeRef = new ChainableNodeRef(getSiteNodeRef());
2016-11-23 13:15:39 GMT <bhagyas> ChainableNodeRef folderAAA = siteNodeRef.createSubFolder("Folder AA").createSubFolder("Folder AAA").addAspect(ShareboxModel.ASPECT_SHARED_FOLDER);
2016-11-23 13:15:39 GMT <bhagyas> Assert.assertTrue(folderAAA.hasAspect(ShareboxModel.ASPECT_SHARED_FOLDER));
2016-11-23 13:15:43 GMT <AFaust> IRC is this way - multiple convos can occur at the same time and people need to pay attention to the different threads
2016-11-23 13:16:19 GMT <AFaust> bhagyas: I am not a fan of chaining method calls that way. I want intermediate results as variables for debugging purposes
2016-11-23 13:16:32 GMT <bhagyas> I wrote a basic implementation, but wondering if it should be made available as a separate library if it has enough interest
2016-11-23 13:16:52 GMT <AFaust> So part of the charm of such an API would be lost.
2016-11-23 13:16:53 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: You can have intermediate results at any point
2016-11-23 13:17:14 GMT <bhagyas> just a matter of typing .var after where you need to break in IntellIJ
2016-11-23 13:17:14 GMT <AFaust> But actually the main thing you want is not an "Identity object" (which we have now) but a "Functional object"
2016-11-23 13:17:14 GMT <bhagyas> ;)
2016-11-23 13:18:01 GMT <bhagyas> yeah, let's not go deeper into design flows in NodeRef class
2016-11-23 13:18:02 GMT <bhagyas> :|
2016-11-23 13:18:23 GMT <irena> how can I check the Hazelcast?
2016-11-23 13:19:26 GMT <bhagyas> irena: Are both using the same database?
2016-11-23 13:19:43 GMT <AFaust> irena: First question would be: Have you even set clustering up for the application servers? What about settings in alfresco-global.properties and share-config-custom.xml?
2016-11-23 13:19:58 GMT <AFaust> Your log should also contain messages about the cluster...
2016-11-23 13:20:19 GMT <yreg> irena, What alfresco version do you have there ?
2016-11-23 13:22:43 GMT <irena> We are using Alfresco 5.0. Yes, I have set up clustering for the servers. Also everything is done right in both files
2016-11-23 13:23:17 GMT <bhagyas> irena: Are you using Enterprise?
2016-11-23 13:23:29 GMT <irena> No, community
2016-11-23 13:23:34 GMT <AFaust> THen there is no clustering
2016-11-23 13:23:41 GMT <bhagyas> phew
2016-11-23 13:24:27 GMT <AFaust> Community does not support that use case out-of-the-box. You can only run it on one application server
2016-11-23 13:24:43 GMT <irena> ok so is there any way to synchronize the changes between the application servers without restarting tomcat?
2016-11-23 13:24:56 GMT <AFaust> No - there is not.
2016-11-23 13:25:21 GMT <AFaust> That is what the Enterprise clustering functionality does: Make sure everything is in sync and stale data is removed
2016-11-23 13:26:28 GMT <irena> ok but since we don't have it and it's already in production can we somehow force the change? Maybe with some service?
2016-11-23 13:26:56 GMT <AFaust> The changes are effectively stored in the database and up-to-date, but one of the application servers still has old data in its cache because it has not been informed of any change.
2016-11-23 13:27:05 GMT <AFaust> No - you cannot
2016-11-23 13:27:35 GMT <AFaust> There is no functionality to manually affect the state of any caches.
2016-11-23 13:29:12 GMT <irena> Hmmm, what kind of side effects?
2016-11-23 13:29:31 GMT <AFaust> basically it can completely break the system
2016-11-23 13:29:43 GMT <AFaust> if done incorrectly
2016-11-23 13:30:39 GMT <AFaust> ___Dave: Is it me or does RM 2.5.a + Aikau 220.127.116.11 add some kind of progress overlay when a navigation occurs via NavigationService?
2016-11-23 13:30:55 GMT <AFaust> I have used Aikau 1.0.9x without RM before and haven't noticed that...
2016-11-23 13:31:04 GMT <___Dave> It's not you, no
2016-11-23 13:31:40 GMT <irena> I think we are still willing to try...
2016-11-23 13:31:41 GMT <AFaust> It's very strange since it is very inconsistent with all the YUI or regular navigation events...
2016-11-23 13:31:51 GMT <irena> It would be better than now anyway
2016-11-23 13:31:54 GMT <___Dave> RM has made use of an attribute on the NotificationService called "showProgressIndicator"
2016-11-23 13:32:15 GMT <___Dave> so the capability is always available on the NotificationService, it's just disabled by default
2016-11-23 13:32:19 GMT <___Dave> RM has switched it on
2016-11-23 13:32:44 GMT <___Dave> it can actually be disabled dynamically through a module provided with RM
2016-11-23 13:33:25 GMT <___Dave> I showed it to the RM team and they seemed to like it
2016-11-23 13:33:29 GMT <___Dave> so have kept it
2016-11-23 13:33:45 GMT <AFaust> Yeah - but they should not force it on the global system
2016-11-23 13:34:03 GMT <AFaust> especially if it is that inconsistent with everything else in Share
2016-11-23 13:34:10 GMT <AFaust> non-Aikau pages
2016-11-23 13:34:19 GMT <___Dave> I don't disagree with that
2016-11-23 13:35:03 GMT <___Dave> I know that the same sentiment has been expressed by other teams
2016-11-23 13:35:07 GMT <AFaust> Also - the module to disable that (found it) is named in a way that I suspect there are other customizations there that I don't know the extent of (or relevance for RM use case)
2016-11-23 13:35:24 GMT <___Dave> again, that's absolutely true
2016-11-23 13:35:52 GMT <AFaust> ~later tell davidwebster: Please add me to the list of people "concerned about some specific Share-header related customizations applied by the RM module"
2016-11-23 13:35:52 GMT <alfbot> AFaust: The operation succeeded.
2016-11-23 13:35:53 GMT <___Dave> I'm not disagreeing with you on any of this
2016-11-23 13:36:27 GMT <AFaust> Well - glad to know I hadn't just missed something in Aikau in general.
2016-11-23 13:36:30 GMT <___Dave> now... to be completely honest, I did actually add it myself when I was briefly in the RM team... but I did say it was up to them whether or not they kept it
2016-11-23 13:36:47 GMT <___Dave> I actually think we could do better in terms of notifying the user when something is happening
2016-11-23 13:36:54 GMT <___Dave> I do agree about consistency though
2016-11-23 13:37:11 GMT <AFaust> shush - don't expose yourself to a hail of rotten tomatos that way....
2016-11-23 13:37:11 GMT <___Dave> but then so much of Share is inconsistent, but I do agree this is quite a noticeable thing
2016-11-23 13:37:30 GMT <AFaust> nobody would have known...
2016-11-23 13:37:30 GMT <___Dave> ha.... there's no shortage of them on here from certain people
2016-11-23 13:37:37 GMT <___Dave> water off a ducks back ;)
2016-11-23 13:38:41 GMT <irena> so basically there is no way of keeping everything synchronized in distributed environment with the Community edition?
2016-11-23 13:38:49 GMT <___Dave> worth bearing in mind that this has been in place for a while and will have been demonstrated to all sorts of different people both internally and externally
2016-11-23 13:39:02 GMT <___Dave> so I would have expected it to be long gone if there was massive opposition to it
2016-11-23 13:39:24 GMT <AFaust> irene: Correct - Community just does not support this use case out of the box.
2016-11-23 13:39:46 GMT <AFaust> Now - you might want to talk with community service providers - some may actually provide such a functionality.
2016-11-23 13:42:17 GMT <irena> Could you please tell me how can I contact them? or who specifficaly?
2016-11-23 13:43:40 GMT <Loftux> #9tecken
2016-11-23 13:44:11 GMT <AFaust> Loftux: Me not understand
2016-11-23 13:44:30 GMT <Loftux> Well lets cal that hope someone can flush the log
2016-11-23 13:44:30 GMT <bhagyas> #nonetaken
2016-11-23 13:44:43 GMT <AFaust> ah...
2016-11-23 13:45:25 GMT <AFaust> ~htmlLogger flush
2016-11-23 13:45:25 GMT <alfbot> AFaust: Error: The "HtmlLogger" plugin is loaded, but there is no command named "flush" in it. Try "list HtmlLogger" to see the commands in the "HtmlLogger" plugin.
2016-11-23 13:45:35 GMT <AFaust> I always forget how it is done
2016-11-23 13:45:46 GMT <AFaust> ~htmlLogger flushLog
2016-11-23 13:45:46 GMT <alfbot> AFaust: Woooosh, your log has been flushed...
2016-11-23 13:46:01 GMT <bhagyas> list HtmlLogger
2016-11-23 13:46:02 GMT <Loftux> ~htmlLogger flushLog
2016-11-23 13:46:02 GMT <alfbot> Loftux: Woooosh, your log has been flushed...
2016-11-23 13:46:13 GMT <bhagyas> ~list HtmlLogger
2016-11-23 13:46:13 GMT <alfbot> bhagyas: flushlog
2016-11-23 13:46:17 GMT <bhagyas> O_O
2016-11-23 14:01:35 GMT <alfbot> davidwebster: Sent 25 minutes ago: <AFaust> Please add me to the list of people concerned about some specific Share-header related customizations applied by the RM module
2016-11-23 14:13:40 GMT <davidwebster> Hey AFaust. What are your concerns?
2016-11-23 14:14:27 GMT <AFaust> I took a look at RM 2.5.a which has as of yet not been included in any of the community file lists but has been released for a while.
2016-11-23 14:14:59 GMT <AFaust> And immediately the progress overlay for page navigation via the header was "noticed" (let's use a neutral term here)
2016-11-23 14:16:15 GMT <AFaust> The concern is that RM module is adding an override to the default behaviour of some Aikau components in Share that leads to a very and quite noticably inconsistent behaviour of the UI, since other components (YUI / regular page navigation via links) will not show that progress overlay
2016-11-23 14:18:38 GMT <AFaust> My comment was mainly because I asked ___Dave about it and he mentioned that some folks at Alfresco have been cautious about this particular UI feature... so I wanted myself added to that list
2016-11-23 14:19:33 GMT <AFaust> If you check the logs the conversation happened not too long ago (as evident by the alfbot timestamp)
2016-11-23 14:42:26 GMT <davidwebster> AFaust, that makes sense, I’ve just reviewed the log. As Dave said he added that in when he was on the team to cover for my paternity leave, but he’s also right that we decided the UX was better with it in. It was left in in specific response to concerns raised internally about the length of time taken to render some Aikau pages.
2016-11-23 14:43:19 GMT <AFaust> So a bandaid instead of reducing the time it takes to render Aikau pages?
2016-11-23 14:43:51 GMT <AFaust> I feel the browser animation of a page being loaded should always be enough indicator that something is happening.
2016-11-23 14:45:08 GMT <___Dave> AFaust - but you understand how browsers work ;)
2016-11-23 14:45:20 GMT <AFaust> As for the Aikau page load times, not all of the tickets I create with issues that can speedup the page load (i.e. stupid RegEx evaluation of JSON model) have been implemented yet
2016-11-23 14:45:54 GMT <AFaust> ___Dave: I know these types of discussions. I once had to defend why I could "expect" a user to know what "Ctrl+X", "Ctrl+Y" and "Ctrl+V" do...
2016-11-23 14:45:55 GMT <davidwebster> and you don’t always get the page loading animation when doing XHR requests
2016-11-23 14:46:09 GMT <AFaust> Because "users are not IT experts - they can not be expected to know this"
2016-11-23 14:46:35 GMT <AFaust> To which I often say: Well - maybe you should not hire people that are not willing to leave the stone age...
2016-11-23 14:46:40 GMT <___Dave> well, let's not get into that discussion here then ;)
2016-11-23 14:46:45 GMT <AFaust> Right
2016-11-23 14:47:11 GMT <___Dave> the point is, that it's not the sort of thing that is likely to get decided here... although I'm sure David will take the feedback to the PM
2016-11-23 14:47:31 GMT <AFaust> Sure - for actions that will not change the active page such an overlay is fine and we always had this in Share with the displayMessage of YUI
2016-11-23 14:47:55 GMT <davidwebster> AFaust: in terms of a “band-aid” for performance - we’ve discussed the issue with Dave, and there’s a performance profiling ticket on the Aikau backlog, but that’s not something the RM team can fix in isolation.
2016-11-23 14:48:22 GMT <___Dave> this also comes back to the same root problem... resources and priorities
2016-11-23 14:48:29 GMT <AFaust> I know, I know - the same old issue of resource priorities.
2016-11-23 14:48:41 GMT <___Dave> I wish I had something more positive to say about it
2016-11-23 14:49:18 GMT <___Dave> but it's a sad truth, the performance could be improved I'm sure but it's not enough of an issue to be prioritized
2016-11-23 14:49:19 GMT <AFaust> Still there are other ways to deal with page load times than putting in an (as of yet) inconsistent overlay.
2016-11-23 14:49:44 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: From what I've read on GitHub, performance has not been a concern for Aikau, take it easy :) https://github.com/Alfresco/Aikau/issues/958#issuecomment-202768104
2016-11-23 14:49:45 GMT <alfbot> Title: Rendering of large widget structures / AlfList views can take a very long time · Issue #958 · Alfresco/Aikau · GitHub (at github.com)
2016-11-23 14:49:47 GMT <AFaust> E.g. what I have done for Aikau-based applications since end of last year is have a kind of "warm-up" process right after Share starts that pre-loads Aikau-based pages
2016-11-23 14:50:09 GMT <davidwebster> The consistency argument is a good one, however the way old school Share is architected lends itself, unfortunately, to inconsistet user interactions. We’re caught between a rock and hard place in RM wanting to improve things but struggling with the legacy from a larger project that can’t move as quick as we can. When we break from consistency, we do so for specific reasons.
2016-11-23 14:51:42 GMT <AFaust> bhagyas: It is fine if it hasn't been a priority from the start - that is just the way it is sometimes. I try to be here now to nudge folk into considering small step-by-step improvements instead of masquerading issues behind an overlay (the user will still have to wait the same amount of time and even with an overlay he will get frustrated after 15 seconds waiting for a page - which I have seen and more)
2016-11-23 14:52:52 GMT <davidwebster> The performance impacts are much more noticable for those of us who run in develop mode permanently, which perhaps biased our decisions, but at least this way we have a constent user notification regardless of whether it’s a full page load or a partial one.
2016-11-23 14:53:13 GMT <AFaust> Yes - debug mode is extreme
2016-11-23 14:53:28 GMT <___Dave> yes, there is a huge overhead in developer mode - which just disappears in production
2016-11-23 14:54:14 GMT <AFaust> But complex page models in JSON can still cause 10s of seconds of load time for other reasons - even when production mode is active
2016-11-23 14:54:34 GMT <AFaust> "initial" load time that is
2016-11-23 14:55:00 GMT <___Dave> yes... we could implement some kind of cache warming, as well as generally making performance improvements
2016-11-23 14:55:41 GMT <___Dave> let's discuss actual solutions though... the quickest way to get this resolved is as follows:
2016-11-23 14:55:44 GMT <AFaust> Currently I write cUrl scripts that log in as a dumym technical user and just touch all the common pages including full Aikau pages like faceted-search
2016-11-23 14:56:28 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: I don't see a rational in believing ___Dave and team should implement performance and other features like any other major JS framework that has thousands of contributors, they are probably doing the best job they can
2016-11-23 14:56:47 GMT <bhagyas> as a small team
2016-11-23 14:57:19 GMT <AFaust> And I don't see a rational in despair...
2016-11-23 14:57:37 GMT <___Dave> I'm not in dispair
2016-11-23 14:57:56 GMT <___Dave> what would be the point of that?
2016-11-23 14:58:04 GMT <___Dave> I'm just trying to be realistic
2016-11-23 14:58:08 GMT <AFaust> I know - that's what I meant as reaction to bhagyas
2016-11-23 14:58:13 GMT <___Dave> lol
2016-11-23 14:58:17 GMT <bhagyas> :D
2016-11-23 14:59:51 GMT <AFaust> ___Dave: You started writing something with "as follows:"...
2016-11-23 15:00:23 GMT <___Dave> yeah... I was going to say that the quickest way is to become a massive Alfresco customer giving them lots of money... and *then* bring up the subject of performance :)
2016-11-23 15:01:16 GMT <___Dave> but given that it's probably not an option for us, the best thing is to keep doing what we are doing
2016-11-23 15:02:19 GMT <___Dave> keep nudging stuff along, as slow as it might be, it's the only option... automated testing is improving internally, that should ultimately make it possible to more easily accept code contributions
2016-11-23 15:02:56 GMT <AFaust> ___Dave: I sort of had that in mind with a customer last year (if you remember my comments about the complex prototype where all the issues came from) - but a) that customer was stingy and b) it didn't end up being an Enterprise customer so no project work followed afterwards
2016-11-23 15:02:58 GMT <___Dave> the code base should continue to get split up into smaller modules which can more easily be tested and contributed to
2016-11-23 15:04:19 GMT <___Dave> unfortunately it's the reality of the situation - Alfresco is running a business, the Community does benefit and get a lot of things for free... but Alfresco needs to pay the bills and grow
2016-11-23 15:04:41 GMT <___Dave> and the business prioritizes things as necessary to do that
2016-11-23 15:05:03 GMT <___Dave> so if performance is "acceptable" it's not likely to be high on the list
2016-11-23 15:05:32 GMT <___Dave> I know that we all understand that here, but sometimes it's worth reminding ourselves of that fact
2016-11-23 15:06:53 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: Also I don't think any of the major customers have moved to Aikau and related stuff - at least yet
2016-11-23 15:07:55 GMT <bhagyas> IF they did, we'd surely see one or two case studies already ;)
2016-11-23 15:08:13 GMT <davidwebster> FWIW, we’ve got large customers currently using Share and RM 2.5 with the Aikau based changes in and they’ve raised performance tickets, but not against the UI, their bottlenecks are always in the repo tier.
2016-11-23 15:09:47 GMT <___Dave> Yes, I've worked with some of our largest customers on Aikau specific solutions
2016-11-23 15:10:35 GMT <___Dave> And as of 5.0 all of our customers will have been using Aikau for search (which is a major feature)
2016-11-23 15:11:34 GMT <___Dave> In all of the performance tests that have been done we've found that Share has minimal impact on performance - as David said - it's always at the Repository level
2016-11-23 15:11:41 GMT <bhagyas> Sure…….
2016-11-23 15:17:36 GMT <___Dave> Aikau is a pretty open book... we have an epic for the issues we do for customers, just as we have an epic for the issues raised by the community
2016-11-23 15:17:55 GMT <___Dave> feel free to review all the closed issues done for both
2016-11-23 15:22:03 GMT <bhagyas> ___Dave: Just out of curiosity, shouldn't the issues be prioritied/classified based on their technical complexity/severity rather than who reported it?
2016-11-23 15:22:55 GMT <___Dave> they get filed under the epic as they are generated - we use the epic in this case for tracking purposes
2016-11-23 15:23:03 GMT <bhagyas> In this case, I feel like removal of this epic classification alone could lead to a more enjoyable development process
2016-11-23 15:23:04 GMT <___Dave> those aren't prioritized
2016-11-23 15:23:18 GMT <___Dave> how so?
2016-11-23 15:23:19 GMT <bhagyas> since you will be able to explain your prioritisation reasons
2016-11-23 15:23:47 GMT <bhagyas> can't they use tags instead of epics?
2016-11-23 15:24:13 GMT <___Dave> probably
2016-11-23 15:24:52 GMT <___Dave> how would that change the order in what gets done?
2016-11-23 15:25:14 GMT <bhagyas> I feel it can change the way 'management' looks at issues
2016-11-23 15:25:33 GMT <bhagyas> and how they get resolve
2016-11-23 15:25:34 GMT <bhagyas> d
2016-11-23 15:25:42 GMT <bhagyas> leading to a better product in overall
2016-11-23 15:26:13 GMT <___Dave> which management would that be?
2016-11-23 15:26:27 GMT <bhagyas> whoever managing the project
2016-11-23 15:26:33 GMT <___Dave> that would be me
2016-11-23 15:26:40 GMT <bhagyas> imagine a police station having two separate queues for rich people and for normal people
2016-11-23 15:27:05 GMT <bhagyas> if they got rid of two separate queues, maybe they can actually prioritise on the severity of the crime
2016-11-23 15:27:11 GMT <___Dave> that analogy doesn't work... there is one queue... bugs first, regardless of originator
2016-11-23 15:27:25 GMT <___Dave> features always come after bugs
2016-11-23 15:27:57 GMT <bhagyas> but it looks like bugs related to non-functional requirements such as performance gets classified as features
2016-11-23 15:28:23 GMT <___Dave> in order for something to be a bug, it would need to "fail" some measurement of success
2016-11-23 15:28:38 GMT <___Dave> and no target performance metric has been set to be failed
2016-11-23 15:28:47 GMT <___Dave> so they're not bugs
2016-11-23 15:29:00 GMT <bhagyas> what are the current performance requirements for the product?
2016-11-23 15:29:09 GMT <___Dave> no-one has set any
2016-11-23 15:29:20 GMT <bhagyas> then you can't call then failed, right?
2016-11-23 15:29:23 GMT <bhagyas> them*
2016-11-23 15:29:41 GMT <bhagyas> or passed for that matter
2016-11-23 15:29:53 GMT <___Dave> correct
2016-11-23 15:31:06 GMT <bhagyas> So, can you fix that?
2016-11-23 15:32:04 GMT <___Dave> you mean can I set a performance benchmark that has to be met?
2016-11-23 15:32:08 GMT <bhagyas> yes
2016-11-23 15:32:16 GMT <___Dave> on what environment?
2016-11-23 15:32:23 GMT <bhagyas> IE8
2016-11-23 15:32:27 GMT <___Dave> no
2016-11-23 15:32:27 GMT <bhagyas> for a start
2016-11-23 15:32:33 GMT <___Dave> because we no longer support IE8
2016-11-23 15:32:34 GMT <bhagyas> then what do you propose
2016-11-23 15:32:39 GMT <___Dave> I'm not proposing anything
2016-11-23 15:32:43 GMT <___Dave> you're the one offering the ideas
2016-11-23 15:32:48 GMT <bhagyas> yeah, sure
2016-11-23 15:32:54 GMT <bhagyas> so let's aim for the current build of Chrome
2016-11-23 15:32:58 GMT <bhagyas> in terms of performance
2016-11-23 15:33:03 GMT <___Dave> on what OS, what hardware?
2016-11-23 15:33:16 GMT <bhagyas> mac, i7, 8Gigs RAM
2016-11-23 15:33:21 GMT <___Dave> I haven't got one of those
2016-11-23 15:33:27 GMT <bhagyas> Then whatever you have
2016-11-23 15:33:28 GMT <bhagyas> :)
2016-11-23 15:33:41 GMT <___Dave> so you want me to base the performance metric of my current machine
2016-11-23 15:33:47 GMT <bhagyas> for a start, yes
2016-11-23 15:33:50 GMT <___Dave> it works pretty snappily for me, so I'm happy
2016-11-23 15:34:12 GMT <bhagyas> so lets publish those so we can reproduce that snappiness
2016-11-23 15:34:24 GMT <bhagyas> across the world
2016-11-23 15:35:14 GMT <___Dave> and say what? Aikau is fine as long as everyone has the exact hardware that I've got?
2016-11-23 15:35:35 GMT <bhagyas> no, as long as anyone has the exact hardware, they should expect the same level of performance
2016-11-23 15:35:48 GMT <___Dave> yes, actually we have a feature for that
2016-11-23 15:35:58 GMT <___Dave> it's not been prioritized for me to work on
2016-11-23 15:36:06 GMT <bhagyas> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2016-11-23 15:36:28 GMT <___Dave> https://issues.alfresco.com/jira/browse/AKU-878
2016-11-23 15:59:46 GMT <qwebirc57416> hello, good afternoon!
2016-11-23 15:59:51 GMT <qwebirc57416> boa tarde!
2016-11-23 16:01:25 GMT * AFaust is catching up after a long skype call
2016-11-23 16:03:09 GMT <___Dave> AFaust: You've not missed much
2016-11-23 16:03:52 GMT <AFaust> it's been a long call so everythign after may last statement
2016-11-23 16:04:00 GMT <AFaust> but sure, nothing substantial anyway
2016-11-23 16:14:42 GMT <ycoulon> is there anyway for share module to apply only on site ? I already use the site.module.evaluator with the sitePresets key but the module seems to be loaded on the repository page.
2016-11-23 16:16:29 GMT <angelborroy> ycoulon what means “loaded”?
2016-11-23 16:17:51 GMT <ycoulon> The JS file added by the extension is loaded when browsing the repository page (/share/page/repository). The sitesPresets works fine (the js is present only for the preset I want)
2016-11-23 16:18:10 GMT <angelborroy> is it a surf extension?
2016-11-23 16:19:08 GMT <ycoulon> an extension in site-data/extension folder.
2016-11-23 16:19:16 GMT <angelborroy> ok, a surf extension
2016-11-23 16:19:27 GMT <angelborroy> are you extending an FTL page?
2016-11-23 16:19:35 GMT <ycoulon> yes
2016-11-23 16:19:40 GMT <angelborroy> which one?
2016-11-23 16:20:12 GMT <ycoulon> just adding my js file with a markup action after for the dnd-upload.get.html.ftl file
2016-11-23 16:20:48 GMT <angelborroy> ok, let me see
2016-11-23 16:21:35 GMT <angelborroy> this region is loaded from many pages: repository, sharedfiles, documentlibrary...
2016-11-23 16:22:00 GMT <angelborroy> maybe you can extend from documentlibrary.ftl after markup dnd-upload
2016-11-23 16:22:44 GMT <ycoulon> thanks angelborroy will try
2016-11-23 16:24:52 GMT <angelborroy> ycoulon or maybe you can make a conditional import of your module
2016-11-23 16:24:55 GMT <angelborroy> by using evaluator.doclib.action.siteBased
2016-11-23 16:24:59 GMT <angelborroy> http://docs.alfresco.com/5.1/concepts/doclib-predefined-evaluators-reference.html
2016-11-23 16:25:00 GMT <alfbot> Title: Predefined evaluators | Alfresco Documentation (at docs.alfresco.com)
2016-11-23 16:28:03 GMT <ycoulon> Thanks for the link. Could find it before. Was using the site.module.evaluator thinking it would do the same
2016-11-23 16:29:19 GMT <angelborroy> ycoulon take a look here https://angelborroy.wordpress.com/2015/06/03/alfresco-customizing-actions-and-document-details-by-user-group/
2016-11-23 16:29:20 GMT <alfbot> Title: Alfresco Customizing actions and document details by User Group | Programming and So (at angelborroy.wordpress.com)
2016-11-23 16:29:39 GMT <angelborroy> ycoulon you can specify where your customization is loaded when defining XML extension
2016-11-23 16:31:34 GMT <ycoulon> The link that I was missing is the evaluators reference
2016-11-23 17:10:35 GMT <ycoulon> ok angelborroy there is a params applyForNonSites in site.module.evaluators that should answer my need, test tomorow
2016-11-23 17:10:51 GMT <angelborroy> ycoulon drop a line when you test that
2016-11-23 17:13:22 GMT <ycoulon> angelborroy: no problem
2016-11-23 17:13:24 GMT <ycoulon> bye
2016-11-23 20:57:38 GMT <digcat> hi all, just reading this http://www.networkworld.com/article/3142780/cloud-computing/vendors-push-the-private-instance-on-a-public-cloud-proposition.html does anyone have any idea on the pricing for this ?
2016-11-23 20:57:39 GMT <alfbot> Title: Vendors push the private instance on a public cloud proposition | Network World (at www.networkworld.com)
2016-11-23 22:40:13 GMT <kfife> Is there an Alfresco mailing list?
2016-11-23 22:46:26 GMT <douglascrp> kfife, yes, but it's not that used
2016-11-23 22:46:37 GMT <kfife> Thanks.
2016-11-23 22:46:47 GMT <douglascrp> you should use community.alfresco.com
2016-11-23 22:46:49 GMT <kfife> Is this the best way to talk to other developers?
2016-11-23 22:46:56 GMT <kfife> Ah... A forum
2016-11-23 22:47:00 GMT <douglascrp> yes
2016-11-23 22:47:09 GMT <douglascrp> and here is a good place too
2016-11-23 22:47:15 GMT <kfife> Great. Good to know
2016-11-23 22:47:19 GMT <douglascrp> if you want to talk with people
2016-11-23 22:47:41 GMT <douglascrp> but depending on the time, you will find almost no noise here
2016-11-23 22:48:11 GMT <kfife> That's consistent with my observations while lurking.
2016-11-23 22:59:21 GMT <douglascrp> the community is the best place to ask questions
The other logs are at http://esplins.org/hash_alfresco