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Daily Log for #alfresco

2017-02-27 08:30:37 GMT <bhagyas> Good morning everyone :)

2017-02-27 08:48:22 GMT <DarkStar1> Morning all

2017-02-27 09:04:08 GMT <bhagyas> Good morning DarkStar1

2017-02-27 09:04:10 GMT <bhagyas> hows stuff over there

2017-02-27 09:04:54 GMT <DarkStar1> bhagyas: Good good. How's the eastern part of the country faring? Still cold? :)

2017-02-27 09:06:34 GMT <bhagyas> snowed yesterday night

2017-02-27 09:06:40 GMT <bhagyas> still covered in snow :/

2017-02-27 09:06:46 GMT <bhagyas> almost slipped twice on my way to office today

2017-02-27 09:06:56 GMT <bhagyas> since the snow had partly melted and invisible

2017-02-27 09:26:53 GMT <yreg> Morning everyone

2017-02-27 09:27:55 GMT <yreg> I have a question: If a have a behaviour triggered on commit and a rule that would trigger for the same action; then which would trigger first ?

2017-02-27 09:28:51 GMT <yreg> What if the behaviour actually triggers on first event / every event ?

2017-02-27 09:30:54 GMT <bhagyas> I think its the chicken

2017-02-27 09:31:39 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: Awaiting comments

2017-02-27 09:31:40 GMT <bhagyas> :D

2017-02-27 09:32:38 GMT <AFaust> yreg: It also depends on the rule, i.e. if it is configured to be executed in the background

2017-02-27 09:33:50 GMT <yreg> AFaust, Ok, then I would like to discover the full chronology

2017-02-27 09:34:07 GMT <AFaust> Rule triggers are policies with EVERY_EVENT notification frequency.

2017-02-27 09:34:26 GMT <DarkStar1> bhagyas: I came off a bike on Friday with all the slushy snow around here. Annoying this slushy crap everywhere. :/

2017-02-27 09:34:33 GMT <AFaust> Any non-asynchronous rule will be triggered before a TRANSACTION_COMMIT behaviour

2017-02-27 09:35:57 GMT <bhagyas> DarkStar1: Urgh, hope you're okay

2017-02-27 09:36:02 GMT <AFaust> But I have to do some more in-depth checks - there is a configuration property for rule triggers that changes that

2017-02-27 09:37:32 GMT <bhagyas> DarkStar1: Why ride a bike in the snow in the first place?

2017-02-27 09:38:57 GMT <bhagyas> DarkStar1: I've been somewhat hesitant to ride bikes in snow, since one of the best gradle/java guys at one of my former employers passed away after getting under a truck after falling off a bike in snow :/

2017-02-27 09:40:56 GMT <yreg> AFaust, So if I want a policy to trigger before the rule, I will need to have my policy triggered on every/first event and the policy should not be run background

2017-02-27 09:41:23 GMT <bhagyas> yreg: policy should run in background whenever possible, unless its outcome is important

2017-02-27 09:41:24 GMT <AFaust> yreg: Ok - so as I said, rule triggers are EVERY_EVENT behaviours, being bound as service behaviours instead of type/aspect ones. Service level behaviours are always invoked after type/aspect ones, so any EVERY_EVENT behaviours you add will always be triggered before rules.

2017-02-27 09:41:53 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: What about the FIRST_EVENT ones?

2017-02-27 09:41:54 GMT <AFaust> Most rule triggers are defined as "execute on transaction commit" so they are queued as a transaction listener.

2017-02-27 09:42:22 GMT <AFaust> Only delete node / delete child association rules are "execute immediately"

2017-02-27 09:43:27 GMT <AFaust> Transaction listener order depends on the listener registration order - so if a single TRANSACTION_COMMIT behaviour was triggered before the first rule was triggered, all TRANSACTION_COMMIT behaviours will be executed before all the rules, otherwise it is the other way around.

2017-02-27 09:43:57 GMT <AFaust> Only execption: Rules that have been defined as "execute in background" will be executed after the transaction commits via the asnychronous action functionality

2017-02-27 09:45:23 GMT <AFaust> bhagyas: FIRST_EVENT is same as EVERY_EVENT in trigger order - it only uses an additional guard for multiple triggers in the same txn

2017-02-27 09:47:18 GMT <yreg> Thank you AFaust, instructive as always !

2017-02-27 09:47:21 GMT <AFaust> yreg: You know my default rule: "EVERY_EVENT is (almost) always preferable to TRANSACTION_COMMIT" - sure looks like the best approach here as well for your behaviours to be EVERY_EVENT or at the least FIRST_EVENT

2017-02-27 09:50:35 GMT <yreg> This brings me to my next question, I want to disable by default content indexing on a content type, and was planning to have a policy setting the flag on every node creation

2017-02-27 09:50:47 GMT <yreg> but maybe there is a better approach

2017-02-27 09:51:43 GMT <yreg> would it be possible to override a default value for a property of an aspect from the model definition of a type ?

2017-02-27 09:52:40 GMT <yreg> Maybe extend the aspect, override the default value and set the child aspect as a mandatory aspect for my content type ?

2017-02-27 09:53:19 GMT <DarkStar1> bhagyas: Bah, could apply that same logic to why get on a plane at all given the amount of disasters we've heard about in the last 3 years, yet most of us at this year's beecon will probably be taking a plane to Spain. :)

2017-02-27 09:55:27 GMT <bhagyas> DarkStar1: yeah, but please stay careful

2017-02-27 09:55:31 GMT <bhagyas> :)

2017-02-27 09:55:54 GMT <bhagyas> you don't have riding hours experience on snow as much as many airline pilots do ;p

2017-02-27 09:59:03 GMT <bhagyas> Just a headsup for everyone, if you haven't tried xrebel, give it a shot - loving it

2017-02-27 09:59:18 GMT <bhagyas> shows Alfresco performance breakdown down to the query level

2017-02-27 09:59:20 GMT <bhagyas> :)

2017-02-27 10:00:55 GMT <AFaust> yreg: Be careful with extending an aspect - you could technically use that to override the default value and use mandatory-aspect to apply it. But there is an issue Alfresco refuses to fix that specifically affects aspects in inheritance chains

2017-02-27 10:01:19 GMT <AFaust> https://issues.alfresco.com/jira/browse/ALF-21806

2017-02-27 10:05:44 GMT <DarkStar1> bhagyas: Actually..... :)

2017-02-27 10:17:19 GMT <bhagyas> AA

2017-02-27 10:17:38 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: Have you noticed differences between Cache implementations of EE and CE?

2017-02-27 10:18:13 GMT <AFaust> Ehm - yes. One is potentially distributed (in a cluster) and other isn't

2017-02-27 10:18:16 GMT <bhagyas> Since the clustering

2017-02-27 10:18:18 GMT <bhagyas> yeah

2017-02-27 10:18:49 GMT <bhagyas> Could it be the CE caching is now crippled due to not being given attention?

2017-02-27 10:18:57 GMT <AFaust> CE is just a simple Google cache while EE is backed by Hazelcast IMap or Google Cache - depending on configured type

2017-02-27 10:19:08 GMT <bhagyas> I was thinking, I might the childAssocRef cache implementation is terrible

2017-02-27 10:19:25 GMT <AFaust> There hasn't been any substantial change regarding CE caching

2017-02-27 10:19:35 GMT <bhagyas> I don't think its Google cache for childAssocRef cache

2017-02-27 10:19:57 GMT <AFaust> The one cache for parent assocs has been that crappy for a while and is even that crappy in EE, because it is not a "regular" cache

2017-02-27 10:20:02 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: As a result of this, its nearly impossible to write a proper module with caching built-in :|

2017-02-27 10:20:15 GMT <AFaust> I can't agree

2017-02-27 10:20:18 GMT <bhagyas> since the SDK doesn't provide caching data structures

2017-02-27 10:20:25 GMT <bhagyas> that are universal between the two

2017-02-27 10:20:25 GMT <AFaust> I have not had any issues with using custom caches

2017-02-27 10:20:26 GMT <bhagyas> :|

2017-02-27 10:20:53 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: Of course a custom cache would work

2017-02-27 10:21:03 GMT <bhagyas> I'm talking about a common DS between that works across

2017-02-27 10:21:22 GMT <AFaust> Just use the standard pattern Alfresco uses for caches (TransactionalCache + cache built by cacheFactory), add the relevant configuration defaults in your module alfresco-global.properties and you should be fine

2017-02-27 10:21:49 GMT <bhagyas> what about non-transactional caches

2017-02-27 10:21:58 GMT <AFaust> ^^ "cache built by cacheFactory"

2017-02-27 10:22:21 GMT <DarkStar1> Just a qq, the person rotscope javascript object, does it retrieve the last successfully authenticated user or the actual current user? I'm observing behaviour that seems to indicate it is not the latter but may be the former

2017-02-27 10:22:30 GMT <bhagyas> will have a look

2017-02-27 10:25:14 GMT <AFaust> DarkStar1: That root scope object should always reflect the fully authenticated user

2017-02-27 10:25:18 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: Looked up any references, can't find any uses of CacheFactory within Alfresco code

2017-02-27 10:25:23 GMT <bhagyas> :|

2017-02-27 10:25:38 GMT <bhagyas> ::DefaultCacheFactory

2017-02-27 10:26:08 GMT <AFaust> DarkStar1: https://github.com/Alfresco/community-edition-old/blob/master/projects/remote-api/source/java/org/alfresco/repo/web/scripts/RepositoryContainer.java#L287

2017-02-27 10:26:09 GMT <alfbot> Title: community-edition-old/RepositoryContainer.java at master · Alfresco/community-edition-old · GitHub (at github.com)

2017-02-27 10:26:26 GMT <AFaust> bhagyas: Use is via factoryBean in Spring context XML files

2017-02-27 10:26:27 GMT <DarkStar1> AFaust: Thanks then the behaviour I am witnessing seems to indicate otherwise. I just wanted to confirm before digging deeper.

2017-02-27 10:27:06 GMT <AFaust> bhagyas: https://github.com/Alfresco/community-edition-old/blob/master/projects/repository/config/alfresco/cache-context.xml#L55

2017-02-27 10:27:07 GMT <alfbot> Title: community-edition-old/cache-context.xml at master · Alfresco/community-edition-old · GitHub (at github.com)

2017-02-27 10:28:19 GMT <bhagyas> wow that's a lot of work to get a simple cache to run

2017-02-27 10:29:06 GMT <bhagyas> cant it be much simpler than that?

2017-02-27 10:29:18 GMT <AFaust> One bean with a single constructor-arg is too much?

2017-02-27 10:29:26 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: tx-cache-context.xml

2017-02-27 10:29:31 GMT <bhagyas> have a look there

2017-02-27 10:29:53 GMT <AFaust> Ok - but then you are not talking about a "simple cache" but a "transactionally safe cache"

2017-02-27 10:30:07 GMT <bhagyas> im looking at contentUrlCache- defined in two places - cache-context and tx-cache-context

2017-02-27 10:30:30 GMT <bhagyas> and it again has defined a contentUrlSharedCache

2017-02-27 10:30:44 GMT <bhagyas> and there is a cache for the cacheKeys

2017-02-27 10:30:45 GMT <bhagyas> wtf

2017-02-27 10:30:49 GMT <bhagyas> O_O

2017-02-27 10:31:56 GMT <AFaust> What the heck are you mumbling about?

2017-02-27 10:32:14 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: Looking at contentUrlCache as an example

2017-02-27 10:32:23 GMT <bhagyas> Not a fan of xml config ;p

2017-02-27 10:33:03 GMT <AFaust> Obviously most of the tx-cache-context.xml stuff could have also just been handled via a factory bean like the simple caches

2017-02-27 10:33:53 GMT <AFaust> The the many contentUrl***Cache beans are not related to any caching complexity, but to the Enterprise-only add-on feature of encrypted content storage...

2017-02-27 10:34:15 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: got any examples of a simple cache?

2017-02-27 10:34:26 GMT <bhagyas> pretty much every bean im referencing are proxied through a tx-cache

2017-02-27 10:35:06 GMT <bhagyas> duh, giving up

2017-02-27 10:35:10 GMT <bhagyas> nevermind

2017-02-27 10:35:41 GMT <AFaust> Seriously?

2017-02-27 10:36:09 GMT <AFaust> I guess I should have submitted that one session proposal I was thinking about: "Overview of caching in Alfresco"

2017-02-27 10:36:16 GMT <AFaust> Thought that was too trivial though...

2017-02-27 10:36:34 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: Don't you think its too much to get a basic data structure to work?

2017-02-27 10:36:45 GMT <bhagyas> ffs

2017-02-27 10:36:47 GMT <AFaust> We are talking about two (2!) beans here

2017-02-27 10:36:54 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: Still 2! beans

2017-02-27 10:37:47 GMT <AFaust> You'd already be done by done with just copy&pasting instead of "ffs"-ing

2017-02-27 10:37:58 GMT <AFaust> "done by now"

2017-02-27 10:38:28 GMT <bhagyas> That time made me think, why would even bother xD

2017-02-27 10:39:45 GMT <bhagyas> It can make already unpredictable Alfresco transactional behaviour much worse

2017-02-27 10:40:08 GMT <bhagyas> talking about CE here

2017-02-27 10:40:10 GMT <bhagyas> :)

2017-02-27 10:40:24 GMT * AFaust is considering a convenience module for Alfresco that provides a simple annotation "@GimmeWhatIWant"

2017-02-27 10:40:48 GMT <bhagyas> AFaust: yes please

2017-02-27 10:41:40 GMT <bhagyas> developing for an Cnterprise with CE focused SDK is broken now

2017-02-27 10:41:49 GMT <bhagyas> Enterprise*

2017-02-27 10:42:11 GMT <yreg> AFaust, the form is still there in case you want to submit an extra talk

2017-02-27 10:42:13 GMT <bhagyas> SDK's, implementations, testing is becoming different everyday

2017-02-27 10:47:31 GMT <Tichodroma> QuickShare and SSO don't work together in 5.1.g :(

2017-02-27 10:49:30 GMT <bhagyas> Tichodroma: do you have a stacktrace?

2017-02-27 10:50:54 GMT <Loftux> Quickshare is really a beast, it just entangled in so many core classes where it really shouldn't have to.

2017-02-27 10:55:57 GMT <Loftux> Tichodroma: Have you tried the "trick" with web.xml edit that is needed to get iOs mobile client to work when using SSO?

2017-02-27 10:59:43 GMT <Tichodroma> Loftux: no, please tell me this trick :)

2017-02-27 11:00:07 GMT <Tichodroma> bhagyas: there is no stacktrace. Share seems not able to login and retries again and again

2017-02-27 11:01:18 GMT <Loftux> Tichodroma: https://issues.alfresco.com/jira/browse/ALF-21521

2017-02-27 11:01:51 GMT <Tichodroma> let me try ...

2017-02-27 11:03:09 GMT <Tichodroma> hm, we've already applied this

2017-02-27 11:09:09 GMT <administ1ator> oh

2017-02-27 11:09:09 GMT <administ1ator> hi

2017-02-27 11:09:43 GMT <administ1ator> anyone here use webdav with alfresco on windows and linux? just curious how robust is the experience between clients and alfresco webdav servers

2017-02-27 11:09:50 GMT <Tichodroma> the request returning 401 is https://host/share/service/components/preview/pdfjs?htmlid=page_x002e_components_x002e_quickshare_x0023_web-preview

2017-02-27 11:17:35 GMT <AFaust> administ1ator: It isn't only a question of the operating system, but also the applications you are using to work via WebDAV. E.g. MS Office on Windows will detect a WebDAV-mounted drive and issue relevant LOCK/UNLOCK WebDAV commands, but other applications may not which can lead to inconsistencies / different behaviour for end users.

2017-02-27 11:19:05 GMT <AFaust> I don't like to give a general answer to "how robust is the experience" because it can differ from customer to customer... Some customers use it without any issues, some have disabled it after trying it out for a while.

2017-02-27 11:20:29 GMT <administ1ator> aha, totally makes sense

2017-02-27 11:22:59 GMT <administ1ator> i was thinking of webdav as the universal way to 'drop' data into alfresco. so mostly the web interface is the way all collaborators can be guaranteed of a uniform experience for uploading and downloading files?

2017-02-27 11:23:56 GMT <administ1ator> i suspected there might be some finicky behaviour around webdav, i really appreciate the heads up

2017-02-27 11:24:08 GMT <Tichodroma> If set <authentication>none</authentication> https://github.com/Alfresco/share/blob/5.1.g/share/src/main/resources/alfresco/site-webscripts/org/alfresco/modules/preview/pdfjs.get.desc.xml , all requests are authenticated. But now only the imgpreview is loaded, not the PDF. Strange

2017-02-27 11:24:09 GMT <alfbot> Title: share/pdfjs.get.desc.xml at 5.1.g · Alfresco/share · GitHub (at github.com)

2017-02-27 11:45:59 GMT <administ1ator> thank you for your feedback.

2017-02-27 11:46:03 GMT <administ1ator> have a lovely evening.

2017-02-27 11:46:04 GMT <yreg> administ1ator, I think there is an issue with moving nodes in webdav using ubuntu, the nodes are actually recreated, instead of being moved

2017-02-27 13:02:27 GMT *** angelborroy_ is now known as angelborroy

2017-02-27 13:48:49 GMT <Marco__> What is the best way to customise the error page in share 5.1 ?

2017-02-27 13:49:23 GMT <Marco__> after some investigation, I found out that in some cases the error page used is the one defined in web.xml

2017-02-27 13:49:37 GMT <Marco__> do I really need to change the web.xml to change it ?

2017-02-27 13:58:56 GMT <yreg> Marco__, do you mean that error500.jsp ?

2017-02-27 14:17:12 GMT <Marco__> yes

2017-02-27 14:17:15 GMT <Marco__> tgat page

2017-02-27 14:17:21 GMT <Marco__> yreg

2017-02-27 14:17:25 GMT <Marco__> that page

2017-02-27 14:18:16 GMT <Marco__> there are other configurations both in the aikau code and in the surf configuration

2017-02-27 14:18:27 GMT <Marco__> but when I access a url /share/page/something-wrong

2017-02-27 14:18:48 GMT <Marco__> share uses the jsp specified directly in the web.xml

2017-02-27 14:21:12 GMT <Marco__> I was also trying to use urlrewrite to redirect the call to the custom page but

2017-02-27 14:21:30 GMT <Marco__> the configuration for urlrewrite is again specified directly in web.xml

2017-02-27 14:32:59 GMT <yreg> ~later tell bmejias ping

2017-02-27 14:32:59 GMT <alfbot> yreg: The operation succeeded.

2017-02-27 14:34:13 GMT <yreg> Marco__, OK, why not fiddle with that JSP and have it redirect to a desired webscript/page of your chosing ?

2017-02-27 14:40:28 GMT <fwu> hello all!

2017-02-27 14:42:12 GMT <fwu> ppl, does anyone knows about any web + mobile ready front end framework to use with Alfresco? Does anyone developed something with Alfresco and these kind of frameworks?

2017-02-27 14:52:19 GMT <Marco__> fwu, there an alfresco client for mobile

2017-02-27 14:54:12 GMT <fwu> Marco__, but then I need to develop for web and for mobile

2017-02-27 14:54:23 GMT <fwu> Im looking for something that I can control both developments

2017-02-27 14:54:58 GMT <fwu> today we dont need to be stick to mobile develpment with a specific dev environment

2017-02-27 14:55:31 GMT <fwu> what I sse is that many customers nly need simple features from Alfresco, and they want a simple interface

2017-02-27 14:55:49 GMT <fwu> develop in share is a pain in the ass

2017-02-27 14:55:59 GMT <fwu> and know there is aikau ...

2017-02-27 14:56:06 GMT <fwu> I want something controled by myself

2017-02-27 14:56:18 GMT <fwu> so I was looking into a html5 framework

2017-02-27 14:56:35 GMT <fwu> does I would develop for both web and mobile

2017-02-27 14:57:12 GMT <fwu> I dont want to change dozens of files to make a simple table in the interface

2017-02-27 14:57:46 GMT <fwu> I may develop something that will be for everyone, but at least will work for my customers

2017-02-27 14:58:10 GMT <fwu> Alfresco needs to develop for everyone, that is why I beleive the interface frameworks are so complicated

2017-02-27 15:02:30 GMT <jpotts> fwu: Don't develop something new. What about using Angular2 and the new Alfresco components based on that framework? And if you don't like Angular2 there is already a client-side JavaScript API so you can use any existing framework you like.

2017-02-27 15:03:21 GMT <fwu> jpotts, i understand. I really dont want to develop things already created for sure!

2017-02-27 15:03:32 GMT <fwu> that is why Im asking you :)

2017-02-27 15:03:38 GMT <jpotts> That's good because the world does not need yet another framework. :)

2017-02-27 15:03:51 GMT <fwu> i will look at angular2

2017-02-27 15:04:12 GMT <jpotts> It's pretty sweet.

2017-02-27 15:05:00 GMT <angelborroy> fcorti is Activiti 6 going to be released in a short time?

2017-02-27 15:23:34 GMT <fwu> jpotts, I looking into angular features, and I dont see nothing related with mobile

2017-02-27 15:23:56 GMT <fwu> doesnt it supports mobile ootb?

2017-02-27 15:24:34 GMT <jpotts> "One framework. Mobile & desktop." https://angular.io/

2017-02-27 15:24:35 GMT <alfbot> Title: One framework. - Angular (at angular.io)

2017-02-27 15:24:53 GMT <yreg> fwu, AFAIK it's mobile ready

2017-02-27 15:25:50 GMT <fwu> it seems I wasnt looking well. I was looking at angular.js

2017-02-27 15:26:04 GMT <fwu> here:http://www.algoworks.com/scripting/angularjs-app-development/

2017-02-27 15:26:05 GMT <alfbot> Title: AngularJS Development Company | Hire AngularJS Developers | Algoworks (at www.algoworks.com)

2017-02-27 15:32:19 GMT <yreg> fwu, check this out https://github.com/Alfresco/generator-ng2-alfresco-app

2017-02-27 15:32:20 GMT <alfbot> Title: GitHub - Alfresco/generator-ng2-alfresco-app: Yeoman Generator Angular 2 Alfresco Application (at github.com)

2017-02-27 15:37:18 GMT <fwu> ppl, can I more or less easly use this in previous Alfresco versions, like 4.2.f?

2017-02-27 15:37:39 GMT <jpotts> fwu: No, it only works with 5.2

2017-02-27 15:37:56 GMT <jpotts> It depends on some REST API changes that are not in earlier versions

2017-02-27 15:38:24 GMT <jpotts> fwu: http://ecmarchitect.com/archives/2016/07/19/4162

2017-02-27 15:38:25 GMT <alfbot> Title: Alfresco embraces AngularJS: Now what? | ECM Architect (at ecmarchitect.com)

2017-02-27 15:38:32 GMT <fwu> so, this is angular2 but already targeting alfresco, right?

2017-02-27 15:39:50 GMT <fwu> also, does it have some support for integrated activity workflows?

2017-02-27 15:40:17 GMT <fwu> this is a big concern I have... the mobile apps for Alfresco doesnt support custom workflows

2017-02-27 15:40:35 GMT <fwu> will I be able to build my owns screens over my custom workflos?

2017-02-27 15:40:39 GMT <fwu> workflows

2017-02-27 15:41:31 GMT <yreg> fwu, no support for workflows inside alfresco, it supports only Standalone activiti

2017-02-27 15:41:45 GMT <yreg> and probably only activiti EE

2017-02-27 15:42:04 GMT <fwu> that is a limitation :(

2017-02-27 15:42:05 GMT <yreg> as the REST API differs between Activiti EE and Activiti CE

2017-02-27 15:43:00 GMT <fwu> when I talk about suporting activiti workflows Im thinking about a way to present workflow steps screens to the user

2017-02-27 15:43:03 GMT <yreg> well the good thing is that it is opensource, so if you are to invest some effort to add some features that not only you would benifit from, I can imagine that to be very well apreciated

2017-02-27 15:43:11 GMT <fwu> it shouldnt be difficult...

2017-02-27 15:43:46 GMT <jpotts> Don't get me started on why they aren't supporting embedded Activiti. Don't EVEN.

2017-02-27 15:44:35 GMT <yreg> fwu, I am sure it is not difficult

2017-02-27 15:44:35 GMT <fwu> well, but what can we do with activiti CE standalone with Alfresco CE?

2017-02-27 15:44:54 GMT <yreg> jpotts, really?! isn't it that obvious ?

2017-02-27 15:45:01 GMT <fwu> i dont mind to use activiti as a standalone product, but I dont see any advantages

2017-02-27 15:45:09 GMT <jpotts> yreg: You are poking the bear.

2017-02-27 15:45:13 GMT <yreg> hehe

2017-02-27 15:45:48 GMT <fwu> Im not getting what you are talking about lol

2017-02-27 15:46:02 GMT <yreg> by the way, jpotts aren't you going to present something @ Beecon this year ?

2017-02-27 15:46:41 GMT <jpotts> yreg: I am going to focus on the hack-a-thon and attending sessions. I don't feel like I have a good topic to present on this year.

2017-02-27 15:46:53 GMT <fwu> but is alfresco targeting embedding Alfresco on the mext releases?

2017-02-27 15:47:05 GMT <fwu> next

2017-02-27 15:47:56 GMT <jpotts> fwu: That's a good question. It's kind of a weird time for Activiti right now. I kind of doubt it but I really don't know.

2017-02-27 15:49:28 GMT <fwu> My feeling is that they are more distant from one another...

2017-02-27 15:49:47 GMT <yreg> fwu, jpotts I really doubt that would be a priority for alfresco any time soon. However, I believe a community party starts investing efforts there, and sets up solid ground for that feature, I can not see why alfresco wouldn't welcome such a contribution

2017-02-27 15:50:22 GMT <jpotts> Agreed

2017-02-27 15:50:27 GMT <AFaust> jpotts: yreg did trigger me last night - seems only fair he is poking the bear with you today...

2017-02-27 15:50:30 GMT <fwu> but does anyone used alfresco and activiti as a standanlone product?

2017-02-27 15:51:07 GMT <yreg> **I mean if someone/some organization from the community makes such contribution

2017-02-27 15:53:06 GMT <AFaust> yreg: Unless there is some move into a proper contribution procedure, I currently don't see any meaningful approach for substantial contributions by the community to any of Alfresco's components. Will likely remain far easier to maintain separate projects that can be combined / reused...

2017-02-27 15:53:45 GMT <fcorti> angelborroy sorry, was in a call... Activiti 6 will be released soon. Cannot confirm officially the date but soon.

2017-02-27 15:54:09 GMT <fcorti> In weeks...

2017-02-27 15:54:25 GMT <angelborroy> fcorti thanks for the info, a customer asked to me as he is now evaluating flowable, camunda and so

2017-02-27 15:54:27 GMT <yreg> AFaust, I guess you are mixing up contributing to Alfresco core/repo with contributing to alfresco products in general

2017-02-27 15:54:30 GMT <AFaust> fcorti: "weeks"? Wow - seems one of my Enterprise customer has been lied to again by the local sales...

2017-02-27 15:55:03 GMT <angelborroy> AFaust Activiti enterprise is available since 2 years ago

2017-02-27 15:55:05 GMT <fcorti> the official date is not out

2017-02-27 15:55:05 GMT <AFaust> yreg: I am not. Where has there ever been a substantial contribution?

2017-02-27 15:56:01 GMT <AFaust> angelborroy: The customer is already using Activiti Enterprise, but waiting on the new release. I may have mixed up your question of Acitivi 6 with the next version of Activiti Enterprise though...

2017-02-27 15:56:18 GMT * AFaust hates the ambigious naming...

2017-02-27 15:56:38 GMT <angelborroy> AFaust just to be clear, no worries

2017-02-27 15:56:57 GMT <angelborroy> AFaust I really like Activiti Enteprise, but none of my clients can afford it

2017-02-27 15:57:09 GMT <angelborroy> AFaust So they are evaluating cheaper options like camunda or so

2017-02-27 15:58:00 GMT <AFaust> I really dislike it for all the stupid issues they decided to re-implement there that were already fixed for Alfresco ECM years ago. And for the completely no-value iframe-like integration into Alfresco ECM that it provides...

2017-02-27 15:58:38 GMT <angelborroy> I forgot you use Actitivi inside Share :)

2017-02-27 15:58:48 GMT <AFaust> In general, I can agree that it may have value in some cases - but for most customer in relation to Alfresco ECM it is just pure overkill

2017-02-27 15:59:46 GMT <AFaust> angelborroy: Activiti inside Repository, if you please...

2017-02-27 16:00:24 GMT <angelborroy> AFaust Is there a new integration for Enteprise?

2017-02-27 16:00:48 GMT <angelborroy> AFaust before that, BPM processes where deployed to repository (aka platform) and forms to share

2017-02-27 16:01:24 GMT <yreg> AFaust, https://github.com/Activiti/Activiti/graphs/contributors https://github.com/Alfresco/Aikau/graphs/contributors https://github.com/Alfresco/generator-ng2-alfresco-app/graphs/contributors

2017-02-27 16:01:25 GMT <alfbot> Title: Contributors to Activiti/Activiti · GitHub (at github.com)

2017-02-27 16:01:30 GMT <AFaust> That is the same. I only meant to say that Activiti runs inside Repository. Only the default UI is in Share

2017-02-27 16:03:28 GMT <angelborroy> AFaust I’ve submitted a presentation for BeeCon about developing generic approval flows by using Activiti inside the repository :)

2017-02-27 16:04:08 GMT <angelborroy> AFaust it’s about an internal task for our new company

2017-02-27 16:04:41 GMT <AFaust> yreg: The Activiti library was never setup as a "product of Alfresco" - they just happened to sponsor it.

2017-02-27 16:04:57 GMT <AFaust> I don't want to start off on a tangent about the state of Aikau here...

2017-02-27 16:05:12 GMT <fwu> ppl, is there something that can help me about getting the actions and screen (fields) configuration from the embeded activiti to present in custom application outside Alfresco?

2017-02-27 16:05:31 GMT <AFaust> Ang the all people on the generator-ng2-alfresco project - apart from Bindu - are Alfresco folk...

2017-02-27 16:05:48 GMT <fwu> I need to know where to get the data, and hot to trigger flows actions into Alfresco

2017-02-27 16:06:51 GMT <yreg> fwu, you could create an extra view for the form webscript in share, or even create your own custom form webscript, but is that really what you want to do ? generate config out of config ?!

2017-02-27 16:07:18 GMT <fwu> yreg my problem is with mobile

2017-02-27 16:07:31 GMT <yreg> If I were you, I would have implemented my forms independently outside of share, and sely on the taskname for picking the right form

2017-02-27 16:07:32 GMT <AFaust> fwu: For the embedded Activiti engine you can use either the default web scripts relating to definitions / tasks etc. or write custom ones

2017-02-27 16:07:34 GMT <fwu> Alfresco apps dont support custom workflows

2017-02-27 16:07:57 GMT <yreg> and ofcourse, I would rely on the REST API for submitting not the old form processor webscript

2017-02-27 16:08:07 GMT <AFaust> ^^ agreed

2017-02-27 16:08:14 GMT <AFaust> Especially if you are using a different UI

2017-02-27 16:08:20 GMT <fwu> and to develop to support custom wf for ios and android is useless, i beleive

2017-02-27 16:09:44 GMT <fwu> yreg, I was thinking in develop the forms outside share indeed

2017-02-27 16:10:02 GMT <fwu> that is why I was asking about the best html5 framework to do that

2017-02-27 16:10:28 GMT <angelborroy> fwu is there any reason not to upgrade to 5.2?

2017-02-27 16:10:45 GMT <fwu> i dont mind to use angular, but angular already target alfresco doest help me with Alfresco < 5

2017-02-27 16:11:06 GMT <angelborroy> fwu your life will be easier by trying that new ADF stuff

2017-02-27 16:11:35 GMT <fwu> angelborroy, dont know yet, but I beleive we are using many components not compatibility with 5.2

2017-02-27 16:11:58 GMT <angelborroy> github addons or custom developed components?

2017-02-27 16:12:03 GMT <fwu> both

2017-02-27 16:12:22 GMT <angelborroy> We are using about 15-20 addons (also mixed) from 4.2.c and no problems to upgrade to 5.2

2017-02-27 16:12:37 GMT <fwu> angelborroy, but if I use 5.2 I can develop for custom workflows for both web and mobile?

2017-02-27 16:12:59 GMT <fwu> for what we were talking about, I undesrtand that is not easy

2017-02-27 16:13:00 GMT <angelborroy> by developing a new web app using Angular 2, yes

2017-02-27 16:13:17 GMT <fwu> angelborroy, ok, my OWN app, right?

2017-02-27 16:13:23 GMT <angelborroy> right

2017-02-27 16:13:27 GMT <fwu> not that develop by Alfresco

2017-02-27 16:13:28 GMT <angelborroy> but you have base components

2017-02-27 16:13:35 GMT <angelborroy> to build faster a new one

2017-02-27 16:13:54 GMT <fwu> but if I develop my owm app, why not targeting alfresco <5

2017-02-27 16:13:55 GMT <fwu> ?

2017-02-27 16:14:05 GMT <fwu> ah, ok

2017-02-27 16:14:08 GMT <fwu> i see

2017-02-27 16:14:19 GMT <fwu> my own with those compenents from alfresco 5.2

2017-02-27 16:14:20 GMT <fwu> ok

2017-02-27 16:14:26 GMT <angelborroy> https://github.com/Alfresco/alfresco-ng2-components/tree/master/ng2-components

2017-02-27 16:14:27 GMT <alfbot> Title: alfresco-ng2-components/ng2-components at master · Alfresco/alfresco-ng2-components · GitHub (at github.com)

2017-02-27 16:16:04 GMT <fwu> so, there are already BPM components

2017-02-27 16:16:13 GMT <fwu> but for Activiti CE?

2017-02-27 16:16:17 GMT <fwu> and custom workflows?

2017-02-27 16:16:27 GMT <fwu> if not they will not help :(

2017-02-27 16:29:24 GMT <fwu> ppl, does anyone knows when the next version of Alfresco will come out?

2017-02-27 16:29:30 GMT <fwu> will be 5.3? or 6?

2017-02-27 16:30:20 GMT <AFaust> No one knows yet

2017-02-27 16:30:35 GMT <AFaust> 5.2 Enterprise hasn't even been released yet

2017-02-27 16:31:01 GMT <AFaust> And there has been no news on roadmap for next 12 months after that to indicate if it's going to be a 5.3 or 6

2017-02-27 16:31:42 GMT <fwu> that is why Im stiking with 4.2.f ....

2017-02-27 16:32:10 GMT <fwu> if I start developing for 5.2 when I finish something there will be an Alfresco 6 out there... lolol

2017-02-27 16:32:41 GMT <fwu> or worst of all, maybe it will be a version not very compatible with may developments

2017-02-27 16:32:59 GMT <fwu> Im not even sure it will have activiti integrated

2017-02-27 16:33:22 GMT <fwu> as a repository, Alfresco is almost a finish product to me

2017-02-27 16:33:37 GMT <fwu> so the big deal is with BPM

2017-02-27 16:33:59 GMT <fwu> so I dont know if I should be looking into Activiti as a standalone product... :(

2017-02-27 16:35:06 GMT <fwu> The Activiti CE should be able to easily integrate with alfresco repository, or not? To upload, and get documents form it

2017-02-27 16:35:07 GMT <fwu> ?

2017-02-27 16:35:31 GMT <IanW1> I did have a jira postpostponed to version 6 recently if that's any help...

2017-02-27 16:36:30 GMT <fwu> IanW1, ehre?

2017-02-27 16:36:32 GMT <fwu> where?

2017-02-27 16:37:46 GMT <jpotts> fwu: I don't want to fuel the fire unnecessarily but you also have to consider the recent Activiti fork. Now you must choose between Activiti CE standalone and Flowable (the project started by Activiti engineers)

2017-02-27 16:38:09 GMT <fwu> jpotts, lololol thats right!

2017-02-27 16:38:28 GMT <IanW1> fwu: https://issues.alfresco.com/jira/browse/ALF-21848

2017-02-27 16:38:36 GMT <jpotts> One of my clients has decided that Flowable fits their needs better so I'm working on some of the integration points between Flowable and Alfresco (and other CMIS repositories)

2017-02-27 16:39:25 GMT <fwu> jpotts, but will flowable be supported at the long run?

2017-02-27 16:39:39 GMT <fwu> forks almost always scare me...

2017-02-27 16:40:42 GMT <jpotts> fwu: I can't answer that because it is too early to tell, but that is also an important question to ask of Activiti

2017-02-27 16:41:24 GMT <jpotts> Although John Newton and others did a Tech Talk and has written some blog posts to reassure people that Alfresco is still fully committed to the project

2017-02-27 16:42:15 GMT <fwu> jpotts, I understand, and I also understand that with flowable will help Alfresco to support activiti integratio, Or else, they may loose the boat

2017-02-27 16:43:18 GMT <jpotts> Well flowable does not depend on Alfresco at all for success, although they certainly get some lift from previous Alfresco and Activiti users. Still, your point about them being a risk is valid. They are essentially a small startup at this point.

2017-02-27 16:48:02 GMT <fwu> jpotts, I only need two things: to have a good BPM in one side and a integration component with Alfresco on the other side. I dont want a BPM solution with "hard-coded" code for the repository

2017-02-27 16:48:54 GMT <fwu> thinking a little bit, most of the integration needed is the need to upload documents to the repository and to get them from the repository will possible security checks

2017-02-27 16:49:01 GMT <fwu> am I thinking wrong?

2017-02-27 16:49:23 GMT <fwu> not "will" bit "with" arghh

2017-02-27 16:57:23 GMT <jpotts> fwu: Both Activiti and Flowable support "Java Delegates" which is one way to do this type of integration. You basically add a service task to your process and delegate that to a Java class.

2017-02-27 16:57:46 GMT <jpotts> The Java class can do whatever you want. In this case it could use OpenCMIS to publish or retrieve docs to/from the repo.

2017-02-27 16:57:59 GMT <jpotts> Using whatever credentials you want to use.

2017-02-27 16:58:11 GMT <fwu> jpotts, that seems nice!

2017-02-27 16:59:50 GMT <fwu> in that way updating a new activiti/flowable version to my logic would be easy

2017-02-27 17:00:08 GMT <fwu> and I would not depend so much from activiti/flowable updates

2017-02-27 17:00:19 GMT <jpotts> Yes, exactly.

2017-02-27 17:02:24 GMT *** jaawerth_ is now known as jaawerth

2017-02-27 17:04:43 GMT <fwu> jpotts, is there a comparison between activiti and flowable?

2017-02-27 17:06:39 GMT <jpotts> 5.22.0 is identical to Activiti standalone of the same version. The 6.0.0 release is the first Flowable release where there may be differences. http://www.flowable.org/blog/2017/02/15/flowable-6.0.0-release.html

2017-02-27 17:06:40 GMT <alfbot> Title: Flowable 6.0.0 release | Flowable (at www.flowable.org)

2017-02-27 17:20:01 GMT <fwu> ok jpotts, thank you~

2017-02-27 17:22:13 GMT <fcorti> angelborroy, AxelFaust, the release date for Activiti 1.6 is around the 17th of March (currently not formal but highly probable).

2017-02-27 17:23:04 GMT <fcorti> AFaust: the release date for Activiti 1.6 is around the 17th of March (currently not formal but highly probable).

2017-02-27 18:47:53 GMT <yreg> AFaust, QQ: Any idea on how to setup AOS with Kerberos SSO ?

2017-02-27 18:48:28 GMT <yreg> I have users compaining about having to login in MS Office whenever they try to edit a file online

2017-02-27 18:48:51 GMT <AFaust> I am no longer working for an Enterprise partner, remember? And the main Enterprise customer I have is still on 5.0.x where AOS is sort-of integrated...

2017-02-27 18:49:13 GMT <AFaust> So no experience with AOS + Kerberos SSO so far...

2017-02-27 18:49:26 GMT <AFaust> But I would expect it should be similar to SPP Kerberos setup

2017-02-27 18:49:58 GMT <AFaust> Or even easier, since it is integrated better into the Repository-tier application

2017-02-27 18:52:59 GMT <AFaust> Simple ideas first: Users have Alfresco added to trusted zone?

2017-02-27 18:54:24 GMT <yreg> AFaust, https://angelborroy.wordpress.com/2016/07/26/alfresco-5-1-aos-troubleshooting/ it seems angel did detect some issues with AOS and kerberos too

2017-02-27 18:54:25 GMT <alfbot> Title: Alfresco 5.1: AOS troubleshooting | Programming and So (at angelborroy.wordpress.com)

2017-02-27 18:54:38 GMT <AFaust> Read that just now as well - no hints though

2017-02-27 18:55:42 GMT <yreg> and I assume that's already done, since this client had 4.2 with SPP before and now we just switched the reverse proxy from the old acceptance to the new acceptance

2017-02-27 18:56:05 GMT <yreg> will keep you posted if/when I find more pointers

2017-02-27 19:21:24 GMT <resplin> yreg: I know some customers have AOS working with Kereberos with the help of support, but I don't know how they got it working.

2017-02-27 19:21:37 GMT <resplin> yreg: The new SAML module (Enterprise-only) support SSO through AOS.

2017-02-27 19:21:54 GMT <resplin> I can get you and your customer invited to the Early Access program if you want to test.

2017-02-27 19:43:45 GMT <fwu> ppl, sorry to ask more questions about activiti, but do you know if activiti community has mobile apps, and if so, does it support custom workflows?

2017-02-27 19:45:06 GMT <resplin> Activiti Community definitely supports custom workflows. I think the mobile apps work with Activiti Community, but I'm not certain.

2017-02-27 19:47:19 GMT <fwu> resplin, ok, I just hpe that the mobile apps also support custom wf

2017-02-27 19:47:39 GMT <fwu> alfresco apps dont support custom wf

2017-02-27 20:02:08 GMT <fwu> ppl, why alfresco 5.2 still comes with web quick start? Isnt this application dead?

2017-02-27 20:10:33 GMT <resplin> fwu: It's not dead. It does what it is intended to do.

2017-02-27 20:21:11 GMT <fwu> resplin, ok!

2017-02-27 20:23:02 GMT <fwu> hmm.. I installed alfresco 5.2, but it seems indetical to 4.2.f in terms of interface. is there something built in angular? I believe all the interface framework was changed right?

2017-02-27 20:27:04 GMT <resplin> No. The angular components are completely separate.

2017-02-27 20:27:15 GMT <resplin> Share is still the primary interface. It had some enhancements.

2017-02-27 20:27:39 GMT <resplin> There are details in the release notes. There is also a lot of information on the ADF at http://community.alfresco.com

2017-02-27 20:27:41 GMT <alfbot> Title: Welcome | Alfresco Community (at community.alfresco.com)

2017-02-27 20:41:41 GMT <fwu> resplin, so only aikau is integrated in share?

2017-02-27 20:58:27 GMT <resplin> aikau is a framework that the newer parts of Share use for javascript composition

2017-02-27 21:00:41 GMT <resplin> fwu: It is possible to use Aikau outside of Share, but it isn't done very often. That is part of why we started the ADF.

2017-02-27 21:01:14 GMT <resplin> And not all of Share uses Aikau. We were slowly rewriting Share in Aikau, but it was proving more expensive than we expected.

2017-02-27 22:22:20 GMT * AFaust sighs... Why for christ's sake does the ADF team insist on trying handle things the way that has already been proven to be broken. "Navigation by path" instead of "by id", "viewer selection based on file extension" instead of "by mimetype"...

End of Daily Log

The other logs are at http://esplins.org/hash_alfresco