Daily Log for #alfresco IRC Channel

Alfresco discussion and collaboration. Stick around a few hours after asking a question.

Official support for Enterprise subscribers: support.alfresco.com.

Joining the Channel:

Join in the conversation by getting an IRC client and connecting to #alfresco at Freenode. Our you can use the IRC web chat.

More information about the channel is in the wiki.

Getting Help

More help is available in this list of resources.

Daily Log for #alfresco

2019-05-13 11:31:26 GMT <gdeverlant> hi everyone

2019-05-13 11:40:38 GMT <gdeverlant> AFaust: Good news it seems that all Kotlin things are removed https://github.com/xenit-eu/dynamic-extensions-for-alfresco/issues/244#issuecomment-491688780

2019-05-13 11:40:39 GMT <alfbot> Title:How the internals is working by which class the plugin is started · Issue #244 · xenit-eu/dynamic-extensions-for-alfresco · GitHub (at github.com)

2019-05-13 11:42:39 GMT <gdeverlant> The plugin is now working like a charm in 6.1.2-ga version

2019-05-13 15:05:40 GMT <gdeverlant_> Wow I just checked Aikau DynamicUI generation

2019-05-13 15:05:46 GMT <gdeverlant_> and it sucks really bad!

2019-05-13 15:05:57 GMT <gdeverlant_> so many manual configuration of crap

2019-05-13 15:06:07 GMT <gdeverlant_> I would say that this is terrible design choice

2019-05-13 15:06:37 GMT <gdeverlant_> Holly Molly Wezus Captain Crap

2019-05-13 15:07:32 GMT <gdeverlant_> those architects and developers from Alfresco are lacking imagination and creativity

2019-05-13 15:08:03 GMT <gdeverlant_> they are going down the rabbit hole of how to make Alfresco developers life a misery

2019-05-13 15:08:42 GMT <gdeverlant_> They should have used the Portlet standard

2019-05-13 15:09:01 GMT <gdeverlant_> and try to minimize the overhead of configuration hell

2019-05-13 15:10:20 GMT <gdeverlant_> and they should build Eclipse Plugins instead of putting all the generators inside of Share interface

2019-05-13 15:11:03 GMT <gdeverlant_> they should hire me for the creative and imaginative part of designing methods for developers friendliness

2019-05-13 15:12:01 GMT <gdeverlant_> XML and JSON is the most abused of standards nowadays

2019-05-13 15:12:35 GMT <gdeverlant_> spring XML's and JSON faceted-search configs oh my god it is HELL

2019-05-13 15:14:31 GMT <gdeverlant_> and Alfresco should move all its core towards OSGi if they want to stay in the game of CMS's

2019-05-13 15:19:18 GMT <gdeverlant_> The main purpose of Aikau is to provide a library of widgets that can be easily assembled into a web application for accessing a repository. The aim is not to replace Share but it was necessary to migrate away from its original implementation

2019-05-13 15:20:12 GMT <gdeverlant_> how to plainly Politically Correct say that the initial architecture was not designed in a way to be upgraded

2019-05-13 15:23:47 GMT <gdeverlant_> Instead of creating a Aikau Visual Editor we run in a maze of config files

2019-05-13 15:29:48 GMT <gdeverlant_> this is becoming really insane

2019-05-13 15:29:48 GMT <gdeverlant_> https://github.com/Alfresco/Aikau/blob/master/tutorial/chapters/Tutorial3.md

2019-05-13 15:29:49 GMT <alfbot> Title:Aikau/Tutorial3.md at master · Alfresco/Aikau · GitHub (at github.com)

2019-05-13 15:30:33 GMT <gdeverlant_> If this was about UI stuff none of the manual things will have to be done

2019-05-13 15:30:44 GMT <gdeverlant_> only from the UI all of the above could be achieved

2019-05-13 15:31:22 GMT <gdeverlant_> UI stuffs should stay in UI and never pass down to manual boiler plate code

2019-05-13 15:31:28 GMT <gdeverlant_> all that should be automated

2019-05-13 15:32:03 GMT <gdeverlant_> Alfresco needs to create their own Alfresco Developer Studio like for Liferay

2019-05-13 15:33:59 GMT <gdeverlant_> Hopefully someone made the OSGi Dynamic Extension AMP

2019-05-13 17:11:56 GMT <gdeverlant_> AxelFaust: you there buddy?

2019-05-13 17:12:24 GMT <AxelFaust> I am now, yes. Back at the hotel (at a customer today / tomorrow)

2019-05-13 17:12:35 GMT <gdeverlant_> you read my messsages?

2019-05-13 17:12:42 GMT <gdeverlant_> is there an history on your IRC ?

2019-05-13 17:13:59 GMT <gdeverlant_> AFaust: Good news it seems that all Kotlin things are removed https://github.com/xenit-eu/dynamic-extensions-for-alfresco/issues/244#issuecomment-491688780

2019-05-13 17:14:00 GMT <alfbot> Title:How the internals is working by which class the plugin is started · Issue #244 · xenit-eu/dynamic-extensions-for-alfresco · GitHub (at github.com)

2019-05-13 17:14:25 GMT <gdeverlant_> I can now debug all of it freely without pauin

2019-05-13 17:16:33 GMT <gdeverlant_> I have a better understanding of the internals how it works

2019-05-13 17:17:44 GMT <gdeverlant_> I will make a prediction in which Magnolia team will probably take the work done for OSGi and Alfresco and implement their own Module based on DynamicExtension

2019-05-13 17:28:31 GMT <AxelFaust> gdeverlant_: I scanned over them (still in late evening conference call)

2019-05-13 17:31:18 GMT <AxelFaust> You know that AIkau is already dead, right? So no point really in learning it at this time.

2019-05-13 17:31:20 GMT <gdeverlant_> AxelFaust: I just installed the latest git pull which is version 2.0.0 SNAPSHOT

2019-05-13 17:31:42 GMT <gdeverlant_> inside of Alfresco 6.1.2-ga and it runs well

2019-05-13 17:31:53 GMT <gdeverlant_> ahhh I'm glad it is dead!

2019-05-13 17:32:03 GMT <gdeverlant_> it is an abomination this idea

2019-05-13 17:32:37 GMT <gdeverlant_> Aikau is maybe dead but all the project which are using it are still living

2019-05-13 17:32:42 GMT <AxelFaust> Also I think you were missing the original point of Aikau. It was never meant (by the developers) to build fully-fledged, custom UIs...

2019-05-13 17:33:14 GMT <AxelFaust> In Alfresco itself, only 2 or 3 pages actually use Aikau.

2019-05-13 17:33:26 GMT <angelborroy> * heating some pop corns… :)

2019-05-13 17:33:27 GMT <gdeverlant_> only the fact that it is so complicated configuring the simplest thing shows me that it was an horrible framework

2019-05-13 17:34:12 GMT <gdeverlant_> how many external clients of alfresco built their project with Aikau

2019-05-13 17:34:17 GMT <gdeverlant_> i'm sad for them

2019-05-13 17:36:20 GMT <AxelFaust> angelborroy: I'll have to disappoint you - I am not planning on providing you with a show where you have time to eat your popcorn...

2019-05-13 17:36:57 GMT <angelborroy> :D

2019-05-13 17:37:06 GMT <angelborroy> I didn’t know we have trolls in the Community

2019-05-13 17:37:11 GMT <angelborroy> This is a new amusement

2019-05-13 17:37:19 GMT <AxelFaust> I am also knowingly ignoreing the bit about Germans + XML from yesterday...

2019-05-13 17:38:36 GMT <AxelFaust> gdeverlant_: What comment I don't understand is the bit about Magnolia, Alfresco, OSGi and Dynamic Extensions.... there you lost me

2019-05-13 17:39:50 GMT <gdeverlant_> yeah my point was that Alfresco and their partner did marvelous job with DE

2019-05-13 17:40:14 GMT <AxelFaust> I mean, I'll have to take a look at Magnolia again after I was extremely disheartened / disappointed two years ago when I wanted to use it as the CMS for my company's homepage (still have no homepage apart from the minimum landing page).

2019-05-13 17:40:19 GMT <gdeverlant_> Magnolia will probably take the bits they need from DE and adapt it to fit their CMS

2019-05-13 17:40:32 GMT <AxelFaust> Most of the work was not even from that partner - they just took over maintenance of it.

2019-05-13 17:40:52 GMT <gdeverlant_> well the code is really good

2019-05-13 17:40:57 GMT <AxelFaust> Because they were using it in most of their projects, and the old developer / maintainer had moved on.

2019-05-13 17:41:31 GMT <gdeverlant_> I analysed step by step the core initialization

2019-05-13 17:41:41 GMT <angelborroy> (I don’t know Magnolia, but I know Liferay and I can say that the code is not really good)

2019-05-13 17:41:50 GMT <gdeverlant_> in Tomcat Debug mode and I can understand it very well

2019-05-13 17:41:58 GMT <gdeverlant_> now Liferay is 90% osgified

2019-05-13 17:42:16 GMT <angelborroy> And this is “good”, right

2019-05-13 17:42:26 GMT <gdeverlant_> development is much easier and the UI framework is not anymore YUI Yahoo lib

2019-05-13 17:42:48 GMT <angelborroy> Which UI Framework? Liferay have about a dozen UIs...

2019-05-13 17:42:49 GMT <gdeverlant_> it is based on React adapted framework called MetalJS

2019-05-13 17:45:51 GMT <gdeverlant_> http://metaljs.com/docs/tutorials/tutorial-todo-jsx/before-we-start.html

2019-05-13 17:45:52 GMT <alfbot> Title:Before We Start - Metal.js (at metaljs.com)

2019-05-13 17:46:03 GMT <gdeverlant_> Vaadin and MetalJS is the best right now

2019-05-13 17:47:04 GMT <angelborroy> I don’t see the point on comparing Alfresco and Liferay

2019-05-13 17:47:30 GMT <angelborroy> Anyway, Alfresco have also Angular and another UI frameworks used before

2019-05-13 17:47:52 GMT <gdeverlant_> Angular is like Spring Framework for the Client side which is an horrible choice

2019-05-13 17:48:10 GMT <angelborroy> ah, ok, it was that

2019-05-13 17:48:12 GMT <gdeverlant_> the ui has to be lightweight

2019-05-13 17:48:24 GMT <angelborroy> ok, I leave

2019-05-13 17:48:26 GMT <angelborroy> thanks

2019-05-13 17:48:29 GMT <gdeverlant_> lol

2019-05-13 17:49:08 GMT <gdeverlant_> Liferay is also a huge Monolith giant product which is now modularized

2019-05-13 17:49:28 GMT <gdeverlant_> all CMS if they want to survive the 10, 20 years future have to go towards OSGi

2019-05-13 17:49:32 GMT <gdeverlant_> there is no other choice

2019-05-13 17:50:11 GMT <gdeverlant_> because it will fail miserably if there is no modularization... by modularization I mean TRUE MODULARIZATION

2019-05-13 17:51:16 GMT * AxelFaust has to go find something to eat. Gone for the nearest China / Thai / Wok place...

2019-05-13 17:51:19 GMT <angelborroy> so you mean than Alfresco is a CMS, right?

2019-05-13 17:51:37 GMT <gdeverlant_> well they offer all CMS parts

2019-05-13 17:52:29 GMT <gdeverlant_> with their own features

2019-05-13 17:52:56 GMT <gdeverlant_> I use the CMS term to simplify my talk

2019-05-13 17:53:39 GMT <gdeverlant_> but who care if it is CMS or not ... my point is big projects If they want to survive they have to go OSGi

2019-05-13 17:54:12 GMT <angelborroy> Sadly the industry is using micro services and Cloud Architectures

2019-05-13 17:54:29 GMT <angelborroy> But (obviously) they are wrong, and the will fallback to OSGi eventually

2019-05-13 17:55:04 GMT <gdeverlant_> well Microservice is a term invented by OSGi

2019-05-13 17:55:26 GMT <gdeverlant_> other took it and redefined it because they saw a market share to steal

2019-05-13 17:55:27 GMT <angelborroy> ah, so Alfresco is in the right direction?

2019-05-13 17:55:42 GMT <angelborroy> I’m confused

2019-05-13 17:55:50 GMT <gdeverlant_> Microservice was to be inside of the same JVM

2019-05-13 17:56:01 GMT <gdeverlant_> like defined in OSGi Standard

2019-05-13 17:56:25 GMT <gdeverlant_> I don't know if Alfresco is in the right direction but the guys who created the DE project understood the future

2019-05-13 17:56:39 GMT <angelborroy> what???

2019-05-13 17:56:44 GMT <angelborroy> Microservice in the same JVM

2019-05-13 17:56:49 GMT <angelborroy> I want to hear that

2019-05-13 17:57:08 GMT <gdeverlant_> well learn OSGi and your life will become a breeze

2019-05-13 17:57:35 GMT <gdeverlant_> but OSGi is too hard for normal Java dudes

2019-05-13 17:58:13 GMT <gdeverlant_> if you never used it you will feel like trapped in a paradigm

2019-05-13 17:58:24 GMT <angelborroy> In English we say “regular”, not “normal”

2019-05-13 17:58:27 GMT <gdeverlant_> OSGi is microservices inside of the same JVM

2019-05-13 17:58:51 GMT <angelborroy> Amazing chat, but I have to leave

2019-05-13 17:59:01 GMT <angelborroy> Thanks for sharing your experience!

2019-05-13 17:59:07 GMT <gdeverlant_> thank you

2019-05-13 18:08:12 GMT <gdeverlant_> microservices outside of OSGi is illusive Microservices

2019-05-13 18:08:26 GMT <gdeverlant_> it is a bastardized term of microservices

2019-05-13 18:09:07 GMT <gdeverlant_> spring didn't want that OSGi becomes their competitor that's why they stopped supporting spring-DM

2019-05-13 18:09:33 GMT <gdeverlant_> and they created their version of microservices which is not real microservices

2019-05-13 18:09:53 GMT <gdeverlant_> they took the idea from OSGi and apply it to their monolith Spring Framework

2019-05-13 18:10:03 GMT <gdeverlant_> and brought the Spring Boot project

2019-05-13 18:12:21 GMT <gdeverlant_> I know this because my brain is connected to the Quantum Entanglement field

2019-05-13 20:47:48 GMT <gdeverlant_> AFaust: Which version of Alfresco are you working with ?

2019-05-13 20:48:54 GMT <AFaust> Anything from 4.2 to 6.1 at the moment, and even have a customer where I may have to work with 3.4 for a while (for a migration project)

2019-05-13 20:49:07 GMT <AFaust> migration/upgrade

2019-05-13 21:21:43 GMT <gdeverlant_> ok I just used the last version

2019-05-13 21:22:00 GMT <gdeverlant_> and started to learn it

2019-05-13 21:22:08 GMT <gdeverlant_> 1 week ago

2019-05-13 21:22:32 GMT <gdeverlant_> which parts of the frameworks are deprecated other than Aukai

2019-05-13 21:22:47 GMT <gdeverlant_> what should I not waste time on

2019-05-13 21:30:38 GMT <AxelFaust> anything in Java that has been marked as @Deprecated...

2019-05-13 21:30:53 GMT <AxelFaust> additionally, multi-tenancy..

2019-05-13 21:31:16 GMT <AxelFaust> and - though not official - the internal workflow engine / embedded Activiti

2019-05-13 21:35:28 GMT <gdeverlant_> alright

2019-05-13 21:55:29 GMT <gdeverlant_> I'm trying to create a universal documentation for Magnolia, Liferay, Alfresco, dotCMS

2019-05-13 21:55:53 GMT <gdeverlant_> and Adobe Experience Manager

2019-05-13 21:57:01 GMT <gdeverlant_> for people who wants to learn to work with all of those

End of Daily Log

The other logs are at http://esplins.org/hash_alfresco